Yeah, I think most people just go about their business. I think most people have other things on their mind instead of judging American tourists.
By the way, Aristippus, are you a hedonist?
In the popular meaning of the word, no. In the Cyrenaic or Epicurean sense, yes.
Wasn’t the Cyrenaic school ultra-hedonistic and the Epicurean school mildly hedonistic?
I’m not an ancient Greek, so here’s my perspective: Ancient Greeks known for being hedonists.
BOOM!
They were both hedonistic in that they identified pleasure (Greek: hedone) as the ultimate good (as opposed, e.g. to simply being ‘virtuous’ somehow), and pain as the ultimate evil. To Cyrenaics, pleasure means the absence of pain, plus something pleasurable (initially the emphasis was on bodily pleasures, but others emphasised mental pleasures). To Epicureans, it is theoretically just the absence of pain. In practice they are pretty much the same, really.
Really? I thought they were known for being Spartan.
I think I prefer the Cyrenaics.
Yeah, they were pretty cool guys. They philosophized and worked out all day, and generally did as they pleased.
I would just be worried that living a hedonistic lifestyle, even in the traditional sense as you said, might lead to the disappearence of things considered pleasurable due to those exact things becoming the norm. Kind of like in Tao De Ching, when Laozi says “all can see beauty as beauty only because there is ugliness.”
All it really means is not making pointless sacrifices, but rather doing what you understand to contribute to your actual happiness rather than just blindly doing whatever. Anyway, in regard to specific ‘pleasures’, I tend to find fairly simple things most enjoyable (probably because they also come at the least cost, i.e. sacrifice with little reward).
I see. But you said yourself that the Cyrenaics did what they pleased. Correct me if I’m putting what you said in the wrong context.
How is that contradictory? They did what they pleased - what they thought would bring them happiness - rather than making conventional sacrifices for little or no gain.
What are these “conventional sacrifices” that you speak of?
In my experience as a non-American, Americans are treated very well in Europe.
Various duties to the state, society and gods, duties implied by traditional virtues, engaging in an unfulfilling cycle of work and consumption for reasons of social status.
@ Wheylous
So THAT’S why you had German on your shirt.
@ Aristippus
Ah, I see. Thank you very much for the information.
I agree that young Americans, particulary students, can typically get loud, drunk, and obnoxious. This is common in the touristy Europeans cities. I find the Americans (though few) I meet in the off-the-beaten countries such as Ukraine, Tunisia, and Morocco far more mature.