Yea, those catholic states have a great history for their liberties. [*-)]
I would argue that New Zealand is the freeist nation. Their military is small and inclusive, their police are benign and there is tons of land and not that many people; most importantly however their population cares little for the things that others do so long as it is not destructive. Yes, there are problems with their taxes on property and land and socialized medicine - however the nation is so lightly populated and the government so small that if you took yourself out of the system almost none would notice.
You can buy separate health care and insurance to remove yourself from the system and the NZ dollar isn’t leveraged to the hilt. They also have quite a strong barter and trade community within the farmers and sheep herders.
If that the best case you’ve got against it being relatively free, try again. Norway also has a state church, and it doesnt seem to have stopped it from being as ‘progressive’ and socialist like the rest of Europe. In practice, state churches are meaningless now. Besides, I am sympathetic to the Hoppean view that monarchies are preferable to democratic republics.
Nowhere, however, did I claim that Leichtenstien was ‘libertarian’. It is a state, after all.
We were not (well, I wasnt) talking about ‘their histories’. I am speaking of the here and the now. Yes, NZ has decent gun laws considering what Australia’s are like, but it has much more meddling in the economy and it has a military, unlike Leichtenstien.
I really hate to say this, as much as I feel (actually I know) that I am enslaved here, but the United States would have to be still on the top list. In terms of economic freedom, it’s actually declining, but is still #6. Here is the list according to the Heritage foundation:
The scores are out of 100, but the absolute score is Bogus in my opinion since they use more mainstream criterion for monetary policy. (You can have a central bank and Fiat money and get a 100%). It’s quite absurd! I think we need to get some Austian influence in there and the scores will all drop by about 30 points.
In terms of Civil liberty, I know that Singapore doesn’t do so well and I’m not sure about Hong Kong but I doubt that it is better the the US.
It may be that if one was to put it all together: Economic freedom + Civil freedom + Education + health care + …, the US may actually still win, or at least come close to win. Of course the US has its military empire, so if we count that, we may actually be in worst shape. What this shows you is NOT how much the US is free, but how the rest of the world is in worst shape. For example, I think the US is still the best place if you want to home school your child (although that is always under threat also) But, perhaps Obama will change all that and finally put us where we belong. It is quite depressing!
However, the era of CHF as a “hard currency” are over, I’m afraid. That was just a cold war phenomena due to the Swiss central bank having to keep a certain amount of gold as backing for the currency it issued. Since the millenia such laws have unfortunately been abandoned in conformation with the EU, and the CHF nowadays is as much junk of a three-letter combination as any other. And maybe even a much riskier currency because all their financial sector will be annihilated soon…
you guys missed a nuanced detail. a small gov’t that strongly protects property rights isnt automaticly more libertarian. since true libertarianism is upholding legitimatly derived property rights, not simply property titles. in places like hong kong and chile, lot of property is tainted with state favoratism
Actually, they’ve been far better for liberties than the secular state has been. Religious states presume they have somebody to answer to, the Lord, and as far as I’m aware most religions forbid murder. At least Christianity does, which it what we’re discussing. The secular state has nobody to answer to but it’s self.
Yeah I realize that. But the CHF still seems to be overall a bit more stable than other fiat currencies. Besides, I’m not heavily invested in the forex anyway. It is mostly just for a little play. [:P]
Wrong country, mate! The most dangerous animal/spider/reptile/anything NZ has is probably the domesticated horse. I challenge anyone to find a living non-human thing that can kill them in that country. No snakes, no big spiders, no crocs, nothing. It has to be the safest in the whole world with respect to danger from animals & insects.
NZ is an ideal place for a libertarian society, but they’re nowhere near there yet. The new govt is making some interesting moves: repealing the law preventing the privatization of prisons, looking to slash ~10% of all govt budgets etc.
They are one of the most ‘atheist’ nations in the world, which seems to help with the more controversial of civil liberties. And there’s enough of a current for it, so I suspect the legalization of marijuana is only a few years away. Fingers crossed!
Haha. Over 50% of the population are still Christians (at the last census, anyway). Probably won’t be over 50% by the time the next one comes around though: (red=percent christian, blue=no religion, yellow=other)
Well actually I was under the impression that Christianity prohibited killing, rather than specifically murder. (This point is not as important, but I heard there is a level of argument that this was only meant to apply to Jews, considering actions held up as OK in the bible after the ten commandments).
But that didn’t stop the Spanish Inquisition, or the crusaders, or the Dolfuss regime, or the Tsarist regime in Russia (&c)
Tzarist Russia was farely benign in comparison to the secular state. I never said religous states were flawless, otherwise I would support one. They’re just preferable to the secular state.
