And even then I’d say don’t judge it if all you got was a bad headache and some paranoia. Dirt weed will do that. I don’t know anyone whos gotten actually gotten high from marijuana for the first time who didn’t enjoy it. More like they started to say things like “What?! This is what it does?? This is what they’ve been locking people up for? What else have they been lying about…”- leading them…erm…straight to the mises.org forums I tell you.
So smoke if you support free-markets
Libertarianism, not libertinism.
No, it makes you unmotivated, slothful, and causes you to exude a generally unintelligent, lazy and overall unlikeable aura. It destroys time which could have been used to do something productive.
Anyone who has been through high school can verify this.
That’s crap, and again different strains will give you different feelings. You can get very motivated smoking, be very creative, and exude a generally friendly, intelligent, and overall likeable aura. Your high is determined alot on how you feel. A lot of people smoke to reduce stress- so yes they aren’t very productive since they just use to it relax. Other times you can smoke when you want to get some new ideas, and you’ll be very productive.. If you want to do some creative work, you’ll do it. Highschoolers, especially in the United States who attend public school, barely do anything productive anyway. With or without marijuana those prone to being lazy are gonna be lazy anyway. I know a lot of highschool kids that spent all their time playing counterstrike or doing something else that “destroys time” but not getting involved in drugs.
And anything recreational can be called a “waste of time”. That’s not an argument. You’re not just doing productive things 24/7 are you? You’d go crazy if you didn’t treat yourself to SOMETHING. I’m sure there’s some activity you engage in that others won’t consider very productive.
QFT
Youre seriously comparing reading a book/listening to music/going for a walk…to smoking pot?
Seriously? Even watching mindless TV for an hour or two is nothing close.
Look, theres a reason why all Austrian speakers I have ever heard, have advocated the legalization of drugs with one caveat; that this was not the same as advocating their use.
You’re seriously going to challenge him? I’ve yet to try the stuff, but he’s described his experience with marijuana as both relaxing and creatively stimulating. How is that any different from reading a book, listening to music or going for a walk to relax or think about life? His ends are the same, and he prefers to employ the smoking of marijuana to achieve those ends. Is there something objectively wrong with that?
That’s not a caveat, just a clarification. Really now, Austrian economics is largely defined by subjective theory of value. I’d think you would be more tolerant of the utility some derive from drug use.
With that said, I don’t agree with Democracy for Breakfast’s rant. Don’t try to convince people of the benefits of drug use; convince them of the NAP and that, as owners of our bodies, we have a right to decide what goes in it. Even if you think marijuana (or tobacco, or meth) is harmful, the most effective way to reduce its use is through voluntary and peaceful means, not coercive means.
What do you think people who smoke marijuana do while they’re high..? They…read a book, listen to music, go for a walk, they can even watch mindless TV for the hour or 2 that the effects take place. You don’t just sit there in a daze. You’re thinking of heroin or something like that if you’re talking about a drug where you’re just completely in your own world and mentally disabled. Marijuana doesn’t come close to anything crazy like that.
So why not do those things without the mind altering substance?
Look, this has clearly gotten a little far afield. My original point was that almost every single marijuana user I have encountered has been, to put it bluntly, unaccomplished, living in some form of squalor and intellectually and physically lazy. One might even say they all tend to have high time preferences;) And above all, they are generally unaware of these things.
Whether or not that hits a little too close to home or not, I dont really care. That has been my personal experience and I have found that most people who are capable of taking an objective look at high school/college agree with me. If you don’t, fine.
My experiences with marijuana have been pretty good, though I don’t use it very often. Maybe once a week?
What do I do when I smoke? Speak to my friends about anarchism, libertarianism, and Austrian economics. Sometimes there is video game playing, but not much, mostly just talking, trying to lure them over to the Light side of the Force.
As for saying it’s slothful, well, that’s entirely subjective to one’s own experience. Not everyone is getting the same thing out of drug use. Certainly some folks who use drugs are being lazy, unproductive, slothful, etc. But you can’t really say how many are being “wasteful” compared to those who are doing productive things. Is it good or bad? Entirely subjective, as I said.
For me, when I smoke, my food taste better, sex is better, and my conversations are calmer and more rational. Much quieter, too. 
Someone mentioned talking about the NAP rather than ranting on the subject, and I whole heartedly agree with this.
I don’t know; my brother and all my high school friends are giant bums who play xbox all day. But I support its legalization.
Some people, myself included, just like to be mentally themselves. It doesn’t matter how minor the effects of marijuana are… it’s still a drug used with the intention of altering your mental state, however slightly. That said, I don’t think anyone here is advocating or would ever advocate using coercion to prevent people from doing it. I also have no vested interest in preaching to people who smoke marijuana as long as they don’t try to force it on me.
Sucks to be them. That is the people, not Marijuana making them lazy. He rather just party and have fun, the easy way through life. I know plenty of pot smokers who are in my honors college.
For marijuana to become more than minorly detrimental to your health you have to do nothing but smoke it constantly for hours at a time which is pointless, stupid, an very improbable
Also if you stick a bunch of knives in your face you die too. I move that all pointy objects be banned for our own good. Cus what if someone used the knife to kill their children cus they’re crazy and stupid?
Lol it is funny because it is win!
I have smoked it, but I have to say “don’t knock it till you’ve tried it” is a weak argument. Why does it hold true for some things, but it doesn’t hold true for suicide or incest? Can I not judge those acts because I haven’t done those yet, either?
A few quick observations:
A good chunk of people self-medicate through one way or another. These can range from the harmful(alcohol, marijuana*, tobacco etc) to beneficial (exercise, meditation) and debatable (religion). It’s part of our nature.
Seph’s comments that the only marijuana smokers he knows are wastes of space doesn’t match with my own experiences. I know ministers, owners of small businesses, chefs who work at high-end restaurants, and people who are practicing attorneys who smoke pot. There are drunks who crack open the bottle early in the morning and there are potheads who spend the entire day, if not most of their lives, in a drug-induced haze. Then there are people who are able to use either alcohol or cannabis and live productive lives. The objective stance would be to say that there is more than one factor when it comes to burnouts.
D for B - I don’t have any problem with leglizing pot. It does not, however, have the majical benefits which you ascribe to it.
I’ve been through the addiction things you mention and I can tell you first hand that it is, indeed, a ‘gateway drug’ - for myself and many others I’ve met along the way. It is especially devastating to the future of young students who get waylaid by the party crowd, the appeal of escaping and distorting reality, and the consequences of doing something in an altered state which effects you and everyone else who knows you and cares about you.
At best, marajuana is a broken window. It fits in very well with Bastiat’s broken window fallacy.
If you believe in broken windows, you decieve yourself. The same is true with the purported ‘benefits’ of pot.
One of the ‘benefits’ of pot is the heavy metal cadmium. Cadmium has the peculiar effect on the human body of causing cravings and addictions. I was fortunate to have had lots of support at a young age and have been ‘clean’ of narcotics for some 30+ years. I am now, however, having to adjust my current lifestyle for the accumulated effects of other poor choices such as alcohol, tobacco, stress, and diet. (not to mention the knowledge I could have gained if I had not been smoking pot.) There is no doubt in my mind or experience that the addictive choices I have made along the way are a direct result of my choice for marajuana when I was young.
This has been a matter of experience and learning in my case. I have seen the same in other who have shared a mutual experience.
The point is that when you say marajuana is NOT a gateway drug, you don’t what you are talking about. You may learn along the way, but it will cost you to do so. It is a gateway to more bad choices - a habit of deception. Your tendency will be to first deny it, then blame others, and if you survive you will either become sullen and bitter or admit your mistake, learn from it, and be thankful you survived at all.
Yeah, I know those people, too, who are ‘successful’ and have lived most of their lives smoking pot who are now in their 40’s, 50’s, or even older, but it is also easy (for me) to see what it has cost them along the way - costs not only to themselves, but to those around them who love them.
Window-breakers do not always pay for the windows they break. They mosty just deny the costs.
Almost every pothead that I’ve ever known has said that it made them stupider.