Long Term Capital Management

Many of us here probably realized that if Long Term Capital Management failed back in 1998, we would not be having a meltdown in the derivatives market and many of the investment banks (Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers, etc) would still be standing. There was a woman back then, namely Brook Burn (I think), she tried to foster regulation onto the derivatives market and she was blackballed by Greenspan and the presidential working group. I was wondering if anyone has knowledge on this occurrence, and and shed more light on the subject of regulation over the derivatives’ market.

Also, do you think that regulations over the OTC derivatives market would prevent 2008 crisis?

  • Ross

What would be the “regulations”? (I detest the use of this term, since most persons it use amorphously, and also tend to find it synonymous with panacea.)

Frankly, I would oppose all interventions and regulations in derivatives, since I find them to be assets that aid in the overall information-processing and self-correcting mechanisms of the marketplace.

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE!!!

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGEEE!!!

I am sorry, but that’s what I feel when I hear this usual nonsense about derivatives market. I am typing in anger right now, so if I end up crossing a line, please forgive me, everybody.

  1. Long Term Capital Management was run BY ACADEMICS NOT FINANCIAL PROFESSIONALS. LTCM was the work of Black, Scholes, and Merton. These were Nobel Prize winning ivory tower Ivy League sheltered academics who had never traded in derivatives market once in their life, even though they wrote thick volumes of books on them. An academic never gets back the money on his forecasts, unlike a businessman. He instead simply makes formulas and charts, and has fellow colleagues, not actual financial results, affirm them. Useless venture was useless.

  2. Brooksley Burns was an idiot bureaucrat trying to interfere in something she did not understand. The over the counter derivatives market is ancient, running back to a century in Chicago, and maybe a few more centuries, if you consider the contracts of Japanese rice traders. The complaint against the over the counter derivatives market is that it is not exchange traded. It is simply done by picking up a phone and calling your contacts in other financial services companies. You make a deal by oral negotiation and recording your calls. Billions are transacted this way. It saves on the clearing costs and requirements of actual exchanges. But it brings the risk of default - a credit risk. However, they have already negotiated means to avoid credit risk by means of “netting” and other such legal agreements. Moreso, they only call up traders they trust, saving themselves the trouble of untrustworthy characters.

God forbid businessmen actually trust each other, and do business on word of mouth and good faith, instead of writing complicated legal documents. That is how Marwars, Chettairs, Parsis, Jews, Armenians, Chinese, and Arabs have done business in the ancient past, and how many people still do it today.

  1. The fear about the over the counter derivatives market was about a crisis that MIGHT happen, not one that EVER ACTUALLY HAPPENED in the past 150 years that the over the counter market has existed. There is already an exchange traded market, where everybody else trades, and for people with a genuine reputation of honesty like Goldman Sachs, there is the over the counter market. There is always risk in business. Government’s job is enforcing contracts and rule of law, not saving people from risks of doing business.

  2. Brooksley Burns was just like every other bureaucrat who starts destructive crusades against business. There are plenty of trustbusters in EU, Japan, and America who do far more harm than good to make a big name. Except instead of trustbusting, she attempted an attack on credit default swaps and collateralized debt obligations that was useless and dangerous. Her colleagues in the government were no less interventionist, and wanted to intervene even back then, but they saw the women as a hotheaded and ambitious. Her attempt to look like a public hero was thwarted.

  3. There has been no derivatives crisis or a crisis caused by derivatives. That’s just talk of financial illiterates and conspiracy theorists like Robert Scheer and people who write for the Economic Collapse Blog. If anything, instruments like credit default swaps and collateralized debt obligations help protect businesses from being burnt badly by the risk of default, and it reduced the damage from the crisis, not increase it.

  4. Credit default swaps and collateralized debt obligations are not even half as complicated as people think it is. I learnt about how they work within a day. I read John C. Hull’s Options, Futures, and Derivatives, which explained them to be straightforward insurance agreements bundled up together. I’d elaborate further, but this post is getting long.

  5. What amazes me is that people argue against these securities, because they find it difficult to understand. If they don’t understand it, why are they alarmed by it?

I am still angry, not at the OP, but at this widely spread misconception.

Great post, Mr. Sanjay. And I share the rage :stuck_out_tongue:

Very good post, thank you for making me understand this much better! We both know that interventionism (by the fed) is the true cause of this crisis.

But…elaborate some more on number 6!

I’d like to know a lot more!

Are you a professional trader? You sound like one.

Oh, Liberte! I finally get to see you in my post! : P - i saw that list of people in your bio - why is Mussolini there?

I am just an autodidactic student of financial markets. Me and my father are self-trained technical analysts, and I help do the technical analysis of stock prices for our day-trading. My father is now a good enough analyst to do it on his own, so we decided I’ll learn and specialise in derivatives instead and get onto doing it regularly once I understand it well enough.

I’ll give an explanation of credit default swaps and other things.

Credit Default Swaps

Two companies, A and B. A has corporate bonds of company C with a face value of $100 million. A earns $1 million interest regularly on those bonds, but there is a chance that C might default on those bonds. So A wants protection.

A buys protection from B. A will pay B $500,000 every year. If C ever defaults, B will pay $100 million to A.

B can pay physically or in cash. If B pays physically, B will buy bonds from C for $100 million. If B pays in cash, B will just pay the market value of the difference.

Suppose C defaults, and can pay 30 cents a dollar to creditors. Market value of A’s bonds in C will come down to $30 million. A can sell the bonds to B for a $70 million payoff. Or A can just receive $70 million in cash from B. A third-party can decide market value in case of cash settlement.

(Actually, A might not even have the bonds, but might be in the same industry as C. So maybe default of one company hurts other companies badly as well. So it just might be done for a notional value of $100 million. Then A can buy the bonds for $30 million and sell to B for $100 million. Or just receive $70 million in cash.)

Market Makers

Large financial institutions like Goldman Sachs buy protection from one company, and sell protection to another company. They earn the difference between what they get from one and what they pay to another. This intermediation saves a lot of trouble of personally finding somebody with whom you can do this transaction.

Asset Backed Security

D is a bank. It has issued 10,000 loans. It sells all these loans to E for cash. E will earn interest on those loans. When the principal is paid back, E will get it.

E earns cash flows from its loans. E uses the cash as collateral for issuing bonds.

Everybody else who invested in bonds in D directly can be confident that the credit risk of the bank is reduced, since D already has cash from E.

E might have $100 million worth of loans on accounts receivable. It uses it to issue three categories of bonds. The first category is $75 million of bonds on which 6% interest is paid, the next category is $20 million of bonds on which 10% is paid, and the last category is $5 million of bonds on which 30% is paid. So if defaults start happening, there might be only $99.5 million cash left. The first category is paid back $79.5 million (interest plus principal for the year). The next category is paid back $20 million (only principal). The last category gets nothing.

Since people in the $20 million category are given neither the highest preference, nor the highest rate of return, E can sell those loans to F, who can issue loans out of them, and so on and so on.

E and F are dealers in ABSes, or asset-backed securities.

Collateralized Debt Obligation

A CDO is just an asset backed security, that is done only for corporate bonds or government bonds.

The government of Petrolistan and three oil companies issue bonds. A big buyer of their bonds can sell them to another company, an ABS dealer, which will use the bonds as CDOs to issue more bonds to others. People wouldn’t buy the bonds directly, knowing that an impending invasion of Petrolistan could cause a default in all of them. But the CDO dealer has indirectly issued bonds to them in such a way that some categories of bonds will have least preference in payment. The rest will have a higher rating. So maybe the bonds of these companies and government have a BAA rating. But through the CDO, they can be split into bonds of AAA rating and BBB rating. Fewer and riskier investors can take the latter. So the invasion happens, and at least 75% of the bondholders get all their money back. Otherwise, everybody would have been paid 30 cents a dollar.

What Really Caused Government To Be Concerned - Synthetic Collateralized Debt Obligations

Remember credit default swaps? Instead of corporate bonds, an ABS portfolio of protection sales is created. This is because being the seller of the protection for a notional principal is like holding a bond. Taking company B from the example above, it can sell the default protection to G. So G will receive $500,000 a year, and will pay $100 million when a default happens. G can use the various sums of $500,000 it receives from various default protections and issue loans itself.

So here’s what made people wonder. A credit default swap is made for a purely notional principal. It is sold to somebody else, who is issuing loans, only on the backing of a default swap and not an actual bond.

When I explained this to my father, it sounded to him like making money and credit out of thin air. Some bloggers said that this was a kind of fractional reserve banking that could have dangerous effects. So I guess there might be reason to be concerned.

Many journalists and government folks felt this was either just a kind of fake gambling or shifting invisible money. So they reasoned, fine, let them do it, but put a close watch on it. It is not done through standardized documents or rules or procedures. All the transactions of synthetic CDOs are done through the phone. Either squeeze it or regulate it or armtwist in them into stopping it. Except synthetic CDOs have not caused a single scandal or problem. When real estate developers defaulted in 2007, many investors were protected and got back their money, because of bonds issued through CDOs. We should be happy for that - it reduces risk, not increase it. Some were outraged, since the breakup of a CCC bond into AAA and junk bonds meant that even the AAA holders didn’t get back their money.

Synthetic CDOs have been going on in the US OTC market since the 1990s, and the 1980s in London. People who engage in it know what they are getting into. As for depositors keeping money with funds that engage in such practices and get their money burnt, even depositors should know the lessons of moral hazard.

If some in Mises.Org find this practice to be fraudulent in the same manner as fractional reserve banking, I invite their disagreement.

i saw that list of people in your bio - why is Mussolini there?

Because he’s way cool.

How so? Why’s in a fascist that interests you? Aren’t you a libertarian just like the rest of us?

How so?

He was a super-opportunistic bastard, and a fan of Max Stirner. He also wrote some good polemics against socialism after his ‘conversion’ to fascism; and calling himself ‘The Prince of Reactionaries’ was pretty cool.

Why’s in a fascist that interests you?

Aside from the above, I like the anti-communist organizations and strikebreakers, the cool outfits and the architectural renaissance.

Aren’t you a libertarian just like the rest of us?

Really depends on who you ask. I don’t believe in morality. I’d say I’m more an Austrian-oriented economist and philosopher with disdain for the State and leftist ideology.

What do you mean you don’t believe in morality?

What do you mean you don’t believe in morality?

I don’t think there is anything true about normative statements. I do think people have ‘moral sentiments’, but that it’s just sociobiology, evolutionary psychology and social signaling. Its logically indefensible. ‘Good’ and ‘evil’ are bogus concepts.

Can you list some examples of normative statements and moral sentiments?

So there’s no right or wrong…?