You really think you’re in a spot to compare yourself to Rothbard?
First you say going after minor issues like raw milk and toilets or whatever is a watering down, then you say do more than talk… By writing a college thesis like 9 people will ever even glance at. Whatever, Neo, take down the source all by yourself by clearing your mind of these distracting, minor issues like the things that affect the daily lives of every single person.
Exactly, fight fire with fire. It has a proven track record.
Yeah low level stuff always helps. Why not “fool people” into electing libertarians? The parties do it and uhhh they get elected. Rand Paul did it. He fooled people to get elected. Ron Paul isn’t a suitable counterexample as he wasn’t trying to “fool people” into electing him. He was straight forward and honest and that is why he was marginalized and taken advantage of.
Read his essay “The Meaning of Revolutions.” It takes all kinds. His writing, as well as anyone else who adds the dialouge into the academic world or the commercial world, are placing influence in the “source material” for academia. The way that it influences the public is different than white which is but standing on the street with signs. But, hey that’s doing something, right? I always reconsider my life values when I pass a few protestors in front of the local courthouse…
When did I ever say “do more than talk”? I don’t think I’ve made that claim. My comment about the soap box was more of a literary device than a direct indictment of what LvMI does, for instance. In fact I think I said that propaganda plays a very heavy role in the psyche of the voting public. Propaganda takes many forms much of which is based on rhetoric which is useful in…speaking and writing. I do, however, remember saying that the ‘higher morality’ argument (high horse) is not strong enough to gain support given the contemporary political and intellectual climate which I will stick by.
Apparently it doesn’t take all kinds, at least not the kind to speak out against the raw mil prohibition or light bulb embargo.
So we shouldn’t do any more than talk…? I can’t keep it straight! It’s like every new statement is an excuse to sit around writing essays, with the sole purpose of inspiring other people to write more essays!
That’s the renaissance, alrighty. Just tell people how things are bad. Eventually, sorcery, then, change! Don’t water it down with nullifying bad policy through disobedience. 2 words: Federal Reserve. Chant it before bed time.
And all this talk of dishonesty… You haven’t ever bothered to earn anybody’s respect, have you? You don’t just write some crap, and magically you turn into a celebrity. You need to engage your rivals, and pretty much everyone you can, all the time. Deception will only get your ass kicked. Rightly so.
First, Habba, you have no idea who you are talking to, so a lot of those criticisms are a) invalid and b), I suspect, projections. What did I start off saying in this thread? Write essays? Or get elected at all costs to jam up the machine? I think you are the one who is purposely distorting words.
The right-wingers already have that covered (boehner and the other big name…Ryan use those issues as “freedom talking points”). Rand is just a sissy compared to his dad. Ron Paul was willing to rhetorically stand up to them and that is why they would have nothing to do with him in public. They aren’t scared of Rand in that way because he plays ball with them. – Water Doooowowwwwnnnn.
Sure I have. I am going to graduate school…I’d imagine it is tough to get in without the recommendation of the professors and the approval of the admissions board that reviews your writings. Does their respect count? Or do you just need respect from strangers on the internet?
Like I said…projections.
Tell that to that woman that wrote Harry Potter. Ironically, she was writing about magic! Whod’ve thunk?
Fun fact: Both Schopenhauer and Hume wished for literary fame early in their careers, Hume got his earlier, but by the time Schopenhauer was like 70 or something people knew who he was. He later inspired Wagner and Nietzsche. Imagine if he would have just engaged people in a positive attitude and dropped the pessimism what he would have accomplished!!
=P
That is totally not what I am doing here, Captain Observant!
Says the average end user. The deceptive are in power. For instance, look at Clayton’s paranoia level. He basically accused me of being a spook or some kind of political operative. Seriously, you are scared of the deceptive. Stop being scared of it and try and see the world as “they” do. “They” have political success. What is the difference between “them” and Ron Paul?
WTF are you talking about? I don’t want you to earn my respect. You don’t get it by being a lying coward government stooge. I promise. No, she promoted her book, talked with publishers, etc, etc, earned their respect and confidence by proving she knew how to sell books.
OK so on one end, don’t earn the respect of internet people… But then this counts as engaging people? Dude, stop. Go back to Pokemon and Farmville.
And power at the cost of decency and… You know, you’ll never get it. You need to have a talk with your parents, or find an wiser fellow to teach you how to be a man.
How much respect does Ron Paul have compared to .. ‘them’? Nobody remembers 99% of politicians, but Ron Paull will be remembered, not for lying and playing the game, not sitting on the computer waiting for people to read his spiel. 18 hour days, 30 some odd years, tireless effort.
You are very confused as to my point of view. I’m not advocating people to get power and to exercise it in any way they want. I am saying get in power to disturb the power structure. Screw up the State through what looks like incompetence, but is in reality malice aforethought. It is far from being a power hungry stooge. Are you aware of what reading comprehension is? Also, how old are you? Are you in high school?
Telling people what you are going to do is what Ron Paul did. Everyone in the Establishment knew what he meant by “liquidate debt,” but very few average voters that I met that liked Ron Paul understood the implications of that (utter destruction of world finance markets). Everyone else in the GOP…lied…and they won (at least until they went head to head with the liberal-side of the Establishment).
We both have anonymous handles. Who ARE YOU??? WHO AM I??? It doesn’t matter we cannot earn respect for anything but your avatar…funny you should mention farmville and pokemon as you seem to be more of that mindset since you take your LvMI handle so seriously (I presume? so as to earn respect for … you? it? I’m unclear…)
I love shit like this. You questioning a stranger’s manhood. Do you remember what I said about…projection?
Do you see the irony? How else can you explain it?!
OK, go right now. Ask your grandpa if lying to gain power is respectable or decent, becoming of a man. I’m going by what you say. So far I’ve gathered from you, arguing on the internet is engaging people, writing theses is action, lying is necessary to advance ‘the movement’, stupid little pictures prove points, and you have never been laid.
And what makes you even think this deception strategy is valid? You can’t just say you want to be in the mafia club, you have to play the part. Hookers, blow, kickbacks. Naive. This is why I say go, act, engage people because it’s so f***ing clueless. Even your local cop has to play the game or he gets booted. This hare brained BS is literally selling out to get a little piece of the cake.
This is what seems to hang you up the most. Have you heard of Plato?
Again, I’m thinking that you are projecting. Every time you take a personal (particularly sexual) stab at someone it is likely a projection. Especially in an anonymous format, when your teenage hormones are raging, and when you have very little counter argument for what has upset you. haha
OK I’m projecting. But aren’t you as well everytime you bring it up, like 90 times now? By constantly telling me I’m prjecting, maybe that’s what you’re doing. Talk to gramps yet?
Ah so you admit it. What am I projecting? The ad hominems you were claiming? No. I am in a pretty good mood and you seem frustrated. My guess is that your back is against the wall (you don’t even get my argument) and need something to attempt to emasculate your opponent so your mind goes to the most emasculating things (things that YOU recognize as emasculating immedately - the things closest to your own worldview). Geez, haven’t you ever read Freud’s lettters!!
You’re talking shit because we aren’t face to face, this isn’t a formal debate, you have no argument, etc.
Yeah, I do not live with my grandparents.
You are still not getting it, kid. You are too emotional to recognize that I am supporting people to get elected in order to muck up the State procedures. That is not asking for the cake. It is trying to gain acces to the cake room so you can “accidentally” tip over the cart.
Read about propaganda. <— Go to page 6 and look at the flow chart. Take it in. Understand it. Understand where you are in it. Understand the implications for all of it.
Not only is it valid it is emplyed 24/7.
Use the phone.
Then name one honest person in power.
Egh, you should respond to my last post more thoroughly.
I’m sorry is this helping your argument or mine? 
So you admit, it is dishonest, your strategy?
Now, did grandpa tell you, lying is bad policy? If holding power requires a sacrifice of honesty, and in all likelihood, other principles, would you still want it?
Indeed, it does. 6,000 years of documented oppressiong, statism, war, genocide, famine, and atrocities of biblical scale. Proven track record.
Clayton -
Duuh, yeah.. I referenced Plato’s ‘Noble lie’ in like post #2. I also mentioned Machiavelli…power + prudence = virtue. You aren’t versed enough in philosophy or political theory to even keep yourself afloat to make points against this. Rousseau supported lying to people to instill virtue. Even one Murray Rothbard believed that there are ethical lines that can certainly be crossed as long as it isn’t violence.
But, on the other hand, there are some people who respect Malcom X, the IRA; Thoreau endorsed violence if it was in the name of good (antislavery-antiwar) in his Plea for Captain John Brown. I think even the founders employed spies and deceit. The Trojan Horse, the honeypot, the false signal; it’s all good. Sun Tzu boils down the Art of War to “that of deception.”
Honestly? My grandpa had an illegal satellite card when I was a kid (he no longer does). He has not purchased a gun since the law has required that they be registered; he did buy some steel bullets when they announced that they were going to be made illegal. He retired when he was in his early 40s because he refused to join a union and they gave him an early retirement package to get him out…I think he’d be okay with what I am saying here. He even calls himself an “anarchist.”
HOwever, my other grandpa would definitely tell me that lying was wrong and that I shouldn’t do it, but then he listens to Glenn Back and I figure…he’s a liar!?
Lying…egh (at least in poltical context, not in personal relationships) shrugs shoulders. (I was going to type an acronym, then I looked at it and just couldn’t so) You only live once, right?
Well, fire is the dawning of technology. It can be good and it could be bad. People need to figure it out. Send everyone copies of The Secret, Clayton.
I see. To advance liberty, we need to not only seek power over others, but sacrifice principles to achieve this power. Did I mention naivete?
Yeah, it is a means to and end thing…and if you don’t even acknowledge the end you won’t be able to wrap your mind around it. But, I can see from the length of your posts that you’re are conceding finally. They’ve really been crushing you under several layers of arguments and you seem to recede a little more after each one like a turtle back into his shell. Do you get that…turtle?
Respond to the last few posts as well.
No. After non-responding to my very first couple of arguments, I knew this wouldn’t get anywhere. “Entertainment purpses only”. I’m not an end justifies the means kind of guy. I let ‘the republicans’ handle that, as well as other statists. I initially called you on slightly less important issues than the federal reserve and you took a huge cop out, and almost putting your essay writing above the real activism and pressure against these things, while touting republicans as the answer to them…
Turtle, like your dick around a pretty girl? Yeah, I get it.
I just meant a turtle that is receding back into its shell. haha. Literally a turtle the … idk, animal. =D Dumbass. Now we know that you are insecure.
Like what? What about that issue would you think I am scared to address? That Ron Paul stood up to the banking and militaryindustrial complex and Rand pushes the same issues as Paul Ryan and Marco Rubio? I thought that you said that I was on the side of the Republicans (because you cannot understand the intention of my jesting infiltration method), but it looks like you are on the side of Rand and Rand is on the side of the Republicans… =/
Can you see where you’ve gone in a circle. And all that claiming I was…? tsk tsk.
You should reread my posts. Maybe go to your dyslexia therapy. I know! I know! There are …uncomfortable moments for you the L train. Just ignore the window and stare at the floor until you get there and make sure you tip whoever walks across the street this time! Don’t try to give them a hug they will not think properly about you…
And I guess the entire LRC staff is with Rubio as well… We’re all statists now! But we’re losers because we won’t lie cheat and steal our way to a position we don’t want, that won’t accomplish anything.
Adding issues to a platform increase it’s scope. That’s a whole lot of minus.