The Paradox of Thrift

Is there any Austrian writing on the Paradox of Thrift?

I was reading a newsletter from a guy called John Mauldin today in which the basic paradox was outlined and this was used as the platform to launch the idea that the government needed to step in and start spending, otherwise everyone’s incomes would go down. However this didn’t seem very intuitive to me. If a bunch of squirrels are saving nuts for the winter, does the squirrel economy need to setup a special task force to throw nut parties to counter the “negative impact” of all the other squirrels saving, which is (according to the theory) driving the squirrel economy into poverty??? I couldn’t see how this could be the case… so the use of money (the medium for exchange) must be playing tricks on us here and leading us to some false conclusions - I was just wondering if that subject had already been covered in detail by some of the Austrian writers before I did a little bit of investigation on my own.

The Mauldin article actually went further and suggested that deleveraging in the banking sector was subject to a similar paradox that, when they deleveraged all together, caused their asset prices to tumble and ironically increased their leverage (even though they were all offloading debt as fast as they could). I’m pretty sure there’s a problem with this argument too.

I came here looking for information as well. The best argument I’ve read in response to this fallacy is that savings are spent because the bank lends the money out. If everyone decided to save 10% of income tomorrow, the consumer economy would suffer, but industrial and capital goods makers would grow.

Frank Shostak has written often on the topic, although I can’t find one that specifically addresses this topic at the moment. Gerard Jackson has also written on this topic. This one comes at it from another angle though.

The Campaign Against Cost Cutting

http://mises.org/daily/1045

Robert Blumen posted an article on the topic on January 9, 2008.

Hayek on the Paradox of Saving

http://mises.org/daily/2804#

The problem with saving in a money market account is that you get ripped off by inflation. You get credited with 2% interest while inflation is 20%-30%. Therefore, you’re a fool to keep your savings in a money market account.

Hm, I’m not sure if that’s talking about exactly the same situation described in the paradox. In the paradox, everyone saves at once - so the banks can’t find borrowers to lend to. As such, there is less money floating around and incomes must go down. Because I’m saving money and not spending it on new shoes, the shoemaker is not making that money (that I’m no longer spending) and so he earns less money and thus has less money to save himself. According to the paradox, I’ll be in a similar quagmire vis a vis my own customers and hence everyone is actually capable of saving less (at least nominally).

About the only thing I can think is that the scenario described in the paradox is quite unlikely. An increase in savings should push down the cost of borrowing to the point that eventually the interest rates are just too tempting and people start to borrow again. Similarly, in a modern banking system, the interest rates would eventually sink so low that there was very little incentive to save. I guess Keynes was writing around the time of the great depression, so the paradox has to be understood in context and was likely an attempt by Keynes to explain the events of those rather peculiar times.

Cheers for the links though. I should have known Hayek would have written on this as he was writing at around the same time as Keynes and the two men didn’t really see eye to eye on all points.

Disclaimer: I read John Mauldin newsletter whenever it comes out (I’m on the mailing list) and he isn’t too far removed from Austrian theory, once in a while he throws in something that is totally unsupported but not too often. It’s a good place to get facts, figures and a general overview of current events since he is quite knowledgable on the economic arts.

Once a week or so, haven’t really figured out the timing, he gets a guest writer to give a different viewpoint to spice things up and get alternative opinions on different subjects which this is one.

The article in question;

That one is pretty interesting and explains how the paradox is avoided in an economy such as our own - the fall in production costs making up for the fall in sales prices.

However I still haven’t found any explanation as to how it might work in the stupifyingly simple squirrel economy. Essentially it seems like money, in the squirrel economy, would prevent savings… the only way increased savings can occur in the Hayekian model is in conjunction with investment and better use of capital and labour… However, if we imagine that the people involved do not want their savings to be consumed/invested immediately, how can these savings be stored in a monetary system?

The only possible answer I can see is some form of debt, so you might have a nut warehouse taking squirrel’s nuts and issuing certificates of deposit, and as lots of squirrels came in and deposited their nuts they walked out with a certificate of deposit for their nuts - so far so good. However in this system the nuts ARE money and new money is being created through the gathering of nuts. In our system, if a baker bakes bread he doesn’t go and put the bread in a bread warehouse - for a baker to save he needs to SELL bread and then take the cash and store it (under his matress or in a bank or something) rather than spending it. If the baker takes that cash and stores it under his matress, and if other people throughout the economy are doing similarly, then the amount of money floating around will drop and incomes will drop without any increase in investment (as Hayek described), and indeed production itself will drop (if people stop buying the baker’s bread and the shoemaker’s shoes, then those people will stop making bread and shoes).

There are only two ways out of this rathole:

  1. Someone, somewhere in the system, aggrees to take the goods of the various producers in exchange for a debt owed… in the same way that the nut warehouse accepted nuts in exchange for certificates of deposit. This is effectively what Keynes was arguing for in that he suggested the government should be buying all the bread and shoes that people were creating… except that governments don’t generally save these things and so are in no position to issue IOUs - they’re better placed to issue “I took your stuff, I’ll try to get it back from somebody else later’s”… Mises would no doubt have something to say about social calculation here as well.
  2. The additional savings of the baker are used to invest in more efficient uses of capital, as Hayek argued and thus only in increasing it’s overall production can the economy as a whole end up with more goods available than when it started.

So it seems like the introduction of a medium of exchange has proved to be a bit of a double edged sword. It prevents saving without immediate investment and thus makes it very difficult to amass large quantities of certain goods against a future need (in the way that squirrels save nuts for the winter). About the only way we achieve that is with futures markets - but I’m not certain these achieve exactly the same result. Has the futures market for oil caused greater existing reserves of oil to be held? Perhaps…

Meh, the Keynesians come up with all sorts of excuses why saving is bad.

If, and that’s a big if, people who saved did so by stuffing their mattresses with their excess cash then you would have the effects you describe.

But in the real world the amount of capital available for investment is disconnected from the amount of real savings because of the fiat currency and fractional reserve banking. If people’s time preference were to change where they preferred goods in the future to present goods then the production cycles would shift from immediately available goods to future goods–the reason that Hayek claims that inflation leads to a lengthening of the production cycle while people’s true time preference hasn’t changed.

For government to step in and make people spend now instead of in the future as is their preference will only lead to overproduction of present goods today at the expense of future goods. As the State has not really found and effective way to force people to spend except to disincentize saving through inflationary losses it becomes necessary for the State itself to spend the future incomes of the people through monetizing debt.

If you accept that the more of a given good there is the cheaper it will be, in this case money, then people saving will lower interest rates and lead to entrepreneurs investing in projects that wouldn’t be economically feasible under a high interest rate–yet another cause of malinvestment under FRB when the FED artificially lowers the interest rate to simulate a low time preference on the part of consumers.

I would argue that the phenomena described in the article is a direct result of the previous inflationary boom where the Fed has to keep the money tap open to stop bad investments from becoming liquidated and leading to an overall depression because of the last thirty years or so of papering over the economic crises.

That’s how I understand it at least, don’t know much about squirrel economics though…

Another thing - if there’s less money circulating in the economy, won’t the prices of goods also fall? Thus, won’t purchasing power remain constant, given falling incomes are met with falling prices?

-Jon

I take it you’re referring to the John Mauldin newsletter… in which case I’d agree.

The squirrel economy was just a thought experiment. Groups of humans could potentially want to do the same thing and so I was wondering how that would/could be facilitated in our current monetary system.

That probably wouldn’t be a problem if production remained constant. But if no one is buying the shoe maker’s shoes, because they’re saving that money instead, then the shoe maker will stop making shoes. Everyone will end up with lots of saved money and nothing being produced.

Hayek explains why this doesn’t happen in our current economies - which is that the savings get used for investment. In the absence of investment, the only other way around it is debt - so people can trade current production against a future claim on goods. If no one is buying their current production (and giving them cash) the only way they could achieve this is by stockpiling inventories… so saving goods/capital rather than saving cash. Perhaps that’s effectively the result of increased production in the Hayekian model if demand doesn’t go up (or prices don’t drop) for the goods being produced - you end up with rising inventories and thus the same savings that our squirrels were angling at.

Good for you, its false and incredibility stupid. Keynes believed that spending money was “consuming” and hoarding money was “saving”.

Hoarding money is what is at issue.

Lets imagine that people were to hoard money, reducing the money in circulation. Would consumption and production fall? No, the same amount of activity would occur, however, the prices of goods would decrease. There is no “correct” amount of money. Our economy would function the same with 1/100th the amount of money; gas would again cost 42 cents. So hoarding is harmless.

But that is not the only reason Keynes is wrong, because in reality people do not actually hoard money in any large degree. When people save they are still spending money. The reason it is savings is because they are spending their money on capital goods and not on consumption goods. If I buy a car to open a taxi business that is savings. I’m spending money, not for its own sake, but to make more money later. How then does my saving reduce aggregate demand? It doesn’t. The same is true if I lend my money to someone else, they will still be spending the money on capital because they need to earn money to pay me back.

You can write this off as 100% fallacious.

Not quite. If there are two sets of shoes and two buyers, should one buyer chooses to hoard his money, then the second buyer will get both sets for the price of one set (Say’s Law).

The shoe maker will think “Oh no, I’ll have to stop making shoes. I’m losing money.” Until he finds out that he is now able to buy two loaves of bread for what one loaf used to cost, meaning he can afford to continue to sell shoes for half price. Nothing changes expect the numbers on the dollar bills.

The person hoarding works to earn money, thus adding to the economy, but does not extract an equal amount from it. This means everyone else gets more.

There is no paradox of thrift. The paradox of thrift is a problem when wages are rigid, which prevents wages from falling when aggregate demand (AD) falls, which causes lay offs and unemployment.

The Keynesian view can be put on a graph like this:

As you can see, according to the Keynesian model, when aggregate demand falls, output (GNP, GDP, etc.) falls also, as does employment. The empirical model of this Keynesian theoretical model is the well known Phillips curve here:

Both of these models are essentially the same. In the first, once AD goes past x, you have inflation and a shortage of labor. The same can be seen on the Phillips curve.

However, Austrians, monetarists, and new classicists disagree with Keynesians. While Keynesians believe that wages are essentially rigid, which prevents businessmen from cutting wages when demand falls, Austrians, monetarists, and new classical economists believe that in a free market wages are not rigid. That can be seen by this graph:

You see, in this model, when demand falls wages fall also, preventing unemployment from happening (at least in the long run) and keeping output (GNP, GDP, etc.) at full capacity.

The problem today, as was with the Great Depression and before, is that government essentially enforces the Keynesian model, meaning that government-enforced union control and minimum wages create wage rigidity which makes our economy look more like the first two models presented, where the supply curve is more horizontal than vertical.

The solution is to allow businessmen to dictate wages at will according to supply and demand and to fire unionized employees, which would prevent sudden unemployment from happening. We also need to remove the minimum wage.

The other part of the solution to this problem is to eliminate a high inflation and high deflation, as to prevent wild real interest rates from spiking demand and supply and then killing it, causing a business cycle.

When you talk about hoarding money, there are two separate monetary systems.

Under a fiat monetary system, hoarding money is pointless. The printing presses will print more money and your purchasing power is lost by inflation.

Under a gold standard AND a free market, hoarding gold is pointless. You’re better off investing it in revenue-producing businesses. Without property taxes, land would be a better investment than physical gold, because you have full allodial title. In the present, gold is the only investment where you get full allodial title.

With a partial gold standard AND a government, hoarding gold might make rational economic sense. If you expect the State to default on its money, then hoarding gold makes sense. As a historic example, consider the Federal Reserve from 1913-1933. In 1932, it made sense to start hoarding physical gold, because people knew there would be a default on the dollar. President Roosevelt frustrated these prudent preparations by defaulting on the dollar and declaring gold ownership illegal.

In a pure free market, there is nothing immoral about hoarding gold. The gold hoarder is missing out on the opportunity to profitably invest his savings. If you hoard gold, prices will fall. However, interest rates will rise or people will switch to other forms of money. In a pure free market, hoarding gold is pointless.

In the present, due to State restrictions of the market, gold might actually be the best investment! If you keep cash or bonds, you get ripped off by inflation. If you own stocks, you really don’t have full title to the corporation; you can’t prevent management from giving themselves huge bonuses or option grants. If you buy land, you don’t get full allodial title due to property taxes. Gold and silver coins are the only investment where you get full allodial title.

Which we’re not - we’re talking about the Paradox of Thrift argument forwarded by Keynes. See OP.