There are two kinds of libertarians

[Stranger]

@ryanpatgray

Who said anything about elections? Elections are not the only way to impact society. Political activism has been mistaken in the past by focusing on candidates. I do not think we should put our faith in candidates but move opinion on issues and ideas. Make the congresscriters come to us rather than the reverse.

You don’t seriously believe that you can persuade politicians to let you be free?

[ryanpatgray]

@Stranger

@ryanpatgray

Who said anything about elections? Elections are not the only way to impact society. Political activism has been mistaken in the past by focusing on candidates. I do not think we should put our faith in candidates but move opinion on issues and ideas. Make the congresscriters come to us rather than the reverse.

You don’t seriously believe that you can persuade politicians to let you be free?

Threat of revolt and revolution has been persuasive in the past. We have models in history that we can follow. One thing I appreciate about Rothbard is that he was a student of history as well as economics. Austrians and libertarians of any stripe should read his works on history as well.

[Stranger]

As a scholar of history, can you remind me when was the last time an elected government was compelled to become more libertarian by threat of revolt?

[ryanpatgray]

@Stranger

As a scholar of history, can you remind me when was the last time an elected government was compelled to become more libertarian by threat of revolt?

2005

[sicsempertyrannis]

@ryanpatgray

@Stranger

As a scholar of history, can you remind me when was the last time an elected government was compelled to become more libertarian by threat of revolt?

2005

Wasnt that orchestrated by the CIA?

[ryanpatgray]

@sicsempertyrannis

@ryanpatgray

@Stranger

As a scholar of history, can you remind me when was the last time an elected government was compelled to become more libertarian by threat of revolt?

2005

Wasnt that orchestrated by the CIA?

I had not heard that if it was. But, for the sake of argument, let us assume that it was. What does this tell us? If an extremely incompetent government agency with a habit of shooting itself in the foot can pull something like off that why couldn’t a group of dedicated libertarians do so?

[Stranger]

@ryanpatgray

@Stranger

As a scholar of history, can you remind me when was the last time an elected government was compelled to become more libertarian by threat of revolt?

2005

First of all that wasn’t a democratically elected government, and second what the hell is Kyrgyzstan anyway?

[liberty_student]

Politics of Kyrgyzstan

In 2006, Bakiyev faced a political crisis as thousands of people demonstrated in a series of protests in Bishkek. They accused him of reneging on promised constitutional reforms limiting presidential power and giving more authority to the parliament and cabinet. They also accused him of failing to eradicate corruption, crime, and poverty. [1]

How un-libertarian must this place have been, for growing government and and corruption to be an improvement?

[ryanpatgray]

@Stranger

@ryanpatgray

@Stranger

As a scholar of history, can you remind me when was the last time an elected government was compelled to become more libertarian by threat of revolt?

2005

First of all that wasn’t a democratically elected government, and second what the hell is Kyrgyzstan anyway?

Yes, it was a democratically elected government at the time. There were disputes about the process but we have electoral disputes here in this country (I live in the USA). The Coleman/Franken race for example.

[ryanpatgray]

@liberty student

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Kyrgyzstan

In 2006, Bakiyev faced a political crisis as thousands of people demonstrated in a series of protests in Bishkek. They accused him of reneging on promised constitutional reforms limiting presidential power and giving more authority to the parliament and cabinet. They also accused him of failing to eradicate corruption, crime, and poverty. [1]

How un-libertarian must this place have been, for growing government and and corruption to be an improvement?

Very. And yes, it was. As for corruption, corruption is found everywhere there are politicians.

[Marko]

@ama gi

Don’t be so cynical. There’s no telling where we would be at this point in history if a significant fraction of the populace consistently opposed government expansion at every turn.

This is false. Limited governement ideas used to carry far more weight with the circles of power. A small governement politician could actually get elected president. Only for governement to continue to grow and libertarian ideas becoming more and more marginalised.

Working with the system has been tried and has proven suicidal.