How do we get Austrian economics offered in every University with an Econ department? What do we need? More professors schooled in Austrian theory and methodology? More clamoring from the student body and alumni? Do we need an exemplary department of Austrian economics somewhere with a full range of courses and texts to pave the way?
The demand is out there, no doubt about it. How about the supply? I see the current environment as such a great opportunity to advance the scholarship of liberty. Does it remain the province of dissident intellectuals, open source dissemination of information or has the time finally come to bring (excuse the cliche) the Austrian point of view to the masses, at a time when people are more receptive to these ideas than ever before?
What does everyone think? I’m throwing the idea out there, what are your thoughts?
I think the supply is enough. Mises.org offers enough free stuff (it is ridiculous really) to anyone who is interested. I don’t like the idea of austrian academics hijacking the university system though. It seems a little hypocritical.
My Econ professor enjoys picking me apart for absolutely no reason. He also tries extremely hard with his crummy jokes to get the class to laugh at what I say, yet he never answers my questions. He’s a typical Keynesian…
It really frustrates me to no end. He’s going to begin to wonder why I never raise my hand anymore. It’s a shame some professors are out there to stifle dissent…really
That being said, we need more Austrians in Universities to challenge the Keynesian approach. It’s very hard to rely on college students with this task.
It really angers me. Within 2 weeks, after exposing myself, it has become a full fledged mock-a-thon where hey let’s all point and scoff at the sole Austrian in the room. Here is some of what the professor claims in response to my questions (which I asked in a very benign and civil manner by the way):
On Minimum Wage:
If we got rid of the minimum wage, everyone would be working at 10 cents/ hour and it would really only serve as a boon for firms attempting to hire teenagers.
On Interest Rates:
The government setting interest rates is really no different from the private sector setting interest rates.
On the government steering the “Green” Economy:
If you look at the past couple of centuries, you will see that the strongest governments have paved the way and often have the best economies. Unless, you plan to refute global warming and prefer everyone choking to death, government pushing us in this direction is the right thing to do.
We seriously need Austrians in the Universities, it’s almost suicide for a student to head to head with a Draconian Professor who won’t even pause to give thought to what you are saying.
ADVICE: Don’t reveal that your an Austrian to an Econ Prof., best to go along with the Prof 100% of the way.
Well, my thought is that the purpose of all the work the LvMI does and all the other folks involved in Austrian economics is not merely for the enjoyment of rigorous debate and intellectual curiosity. There is an end goal of changing the world and bringing these ideas to the broader public. Maybe that requires more conventional methods like offering courses at the undergrad and post-grad levels, connecting more with the homeschooling crowd, and even working with public schools. The same generosity and effort that went into creating the Mises Institute can do the same in other areas; scholarships, endowments, research grants, funds to setup departments at universities, etc.
You have to remember that economics as a whole is a small profession and that the Austrian POV is a tiny minority in that small profession. There won’t be undergrad and grad courses from the Austrian POV for at least another generation, IMO. We simply need to train a new generation of economists who became interested in the subject through organizations like LvMI.
This is your econ prof? Most econ profs and TAs I have encountered are very much against the minimum wage. Hell, I bet you even Paul Krugman is against the minimum wage.
TBH, I’ve found that more non-economists know the likes of Hayek and Rothbard; Hayek for his emphasis on emergence and Rothbard for his work on history (political). So I can’t say that it’s a total loss that the Economics profession has marginalized such folks. In many ways, I think it’s been a boon because if it wasn’t for Hayek’s ideas neural nets and AI theory as we know it today would’ve never gotten off the ground. And for Rothbard, many political theorists wouldn’t have a good resource to the mainstream non-revisionist history (aka the State history). It’s quite interesting how the Psychological School being the rogue (or dark horse) of economics has made it more impactful on other disciplines (like Computer and Political Sciences) that it could have a more lasting effect on the world than any fad that exists as dominant in economics today.
I understand the idea behind having a course strictly on Austrian economics but I doubt it will happen. However, this doesn’t mean that all is lost. The Austrian school will continue to influence more and more people as the government continues to prolong this depression. This opens the door for the proliferation of Austrian ideas and likely to Austrians teaching at many colleges and universities. Essentially we could have Austrians teaching economics courses, while not labeled “Austrian Eco. 101” the professors will teach economics from an Austrian perspective. I plan on going to grad school for an MBA in international economics; while my end goal is not to be a professor (I want to actually make money) I would consider doing it later in life.
I completely understand what you mean as I had this happen to me last year as well with a moron Keynesian professor. To the guy’s credit he did allow me to debate him but then he would continue talking through the rest of the class without permitting me to respond in full. When I brought up the idea of a stateless society he wouldn’t even let me go further he just said something like “Do you hear what he is saying? A stateless society? This is ridiculous haha.” You know what’s ridiculous - thinking that printing pieces of paper and building pyramids creates wealth. Difference in schools aside this man was honestly one of the dumbest people I have ever encountered at college. He also claimed that Austrians didn’t use math and that because I could not use a mathematical equation to say when the recession would end I had no credibility. He of course, wouldn’t give the class the secret recipe to determine this.
Whenever I bring up Austrian economics they simply say they don’t want to talk about it. My Post Keynesian professor is from Austria and went to the university of Vienna. Whenever I mention Hayek, he responds with “I left Vienna for a reason!”
Your professor’s arguments are easily refuted. Ask him what he thinks the minimum wage should be, if he agrees with Keynes that wages are sticky downwards (causing unemployment), and about previous real wage rates during periods without minimum wage laws (1880-1896 saw 85% increase in real wages).
Also, your professor probably isn’t Keynesian. He sounds like an institutionalist.
In Sweden we practice social isolation of students who speak during lectures. Seriosuly though lectures are one-way communication by design, I don’t see how you could learn anything if you allow students to express opinions during them. That is what seminars and workshops are for.
Unfortunately if you hand in a summary from you seminar discussion where you discussed the austrian perceptive you will get it back with: Fail, you where supposed to discuss economics.
I understand where you are coming from. The university system isn’t exactly the great bastion of free and open thought as they would like us to believe it is. I have had my fair share of run ins with professors, and getting away with your own opinions is a matter of great skill. Of course, one could just shutup and be a fly on the wall throughout the semester. I have had success by, like any salesman, gauging the temperament of the professor and the classroom, and adding to the class with, not explicit logic or Austrian POV, but rather a general inquiry or statement that by its nature will buck the prevailing current of the classroom. Once you get the hang of it, it’s possible to be effective in challenging the prof without being so obvious, and can be quite satisfying. Maybe I can get away with it a little better as I’ve been a teacher before, but I digress.
As has been mentioned, this can backfire, I’ve had grades shot to hell once over continually prodding a professor. C’est la vie.
Back to Austrian Econ 101, my concern is that if Austrian scholarship remains solely within the realm of LvMI and open source information, its reach and audience will be limited. I’m trying to come up with ways of marketing, educational brokerage. How do we meet the demand with supply!
Agreed, lectures are definitely not the place for debate. A lecture is designed so the professor can communicate to you what he understands about a given topic, not the other way around. If a professor doesn’t “adequately respond” to your criticisms, its probably because he doesn’t have time to both debate the pros-and-cons of a stateless society and finish his lecture on monopolistic competition.
That isn’t to say you should accept everything in a lecture as gospel truth or even that you shouldn’t ask questions, but if you want to probe their thoughts on this or that aspect of Austrian economics do it outside of class. Send them an e-mail, visit them during office hours, etc.
Its really the only polite thing to do, because you share the class with other students and they are probably more interested in what the professor has to say than what you have say (seeing as they signed up for his class and not yours).
Reading the posts here makes me glad I did a Physics degree. I used to ask tons of questions, less now; and my professors would love it, I even correct them at times, and they are humble and even smile about it. Though a lot of times I’m wrong and have made a fool of myself, but I never really cared about that anyway![:P]
Not one of my professors do I not refer to with their first name either, I guess I’ve been spoiled by their lack of pretension given what I’ve read here. I showed the head ofresearch in my department Mises’ derivation of the law of returns and he seemed impressed.