Greetings,
What is the libertarian/Austrian take on illegal immigration. Opinions and links are appreciated.
It is not rational to discriminate against others, economically, based upon which side of a river, mountain range, ocean or imaginary line they are born. Nationalism is as egregious and irrational a belief as racism, sexism or homophobia.
Kinda on topic, try reading this https://forum.freecapitalists.org/blogs/brainpolice/archive/2008/03/30/the-case-for-free-immigration-the-case-against-borders.aspx
this is really good 
keep it coming
“Illegal Immigration” is a 100% artificial problem, just like everything else the State does.
The migrant workers aren’t terrible, evil people. Some are legitimately trying to make a better life for themselves and their families. They should not, however, expect to come here just to get a free welfare check every month.
If they work, I see no reason why they shouldn’t stay. Work is honorable.
Freedom of movement baby, freedom of movement. What crime are “illegal” immigrants commiting.
We discussed this a little bit on another thread. The problem is that, even when illegal immigrants don’t get physical paychecks from the government, they’re still using everything for free that the taxpayer funds. Hospitals. Public schools. And they even get in-state tuition. The whole problem has its foundation in the welfare world.
Freedom of movement baby, freedom of movement. What crime are “illegal” immigrants commiting.
Not to be a smart ass, but some have killed Americans.
You don’t sound like a smart ass at all. You seriously can’t go for a hike in the desert in Arizona without seeing rape trees and litter everywhere. It’s disgusting.
Example 1: http://media.nowpublic.net/images//ee/8/ee86c3e32bb2dcf247d6e37e1a18f5a5.jpg
Example 2: http://thereaganwing.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/desert-2.jpg
Gipper, I pretty sure you know what a meant If they have aggressed against citizens then they should be punished but if they are coming here to work and a property owner has agreed to employ them then what crime have they commited.
Here’s a problem that I presented to someone who believes that ilegal immigration is justified. Say one of those illegals have property here in the US, then why must they obtain permission to come to America to enjoy what is rightfully theirs. If you say I own the property within a country, then I should be able to use that property as I see fit. The very fact that the government can keep me away from my property at their whim is a violation of the fact that I own that propety, citizen or not.
This application goes on further to family members. In this argument the family are legal citizens and the illegal is one who wishes to stay with them. Now if property rights are respected (which the state rarely if ever does) then the citizen family should be allowed to have whoever they want over to enjoy their property and any hinderence to that illegal family member from coming over states that the state once again does not value your property as being yours since you can’t invite any person you would wish to have over.
Lastly, if both statements are held true then we can apply this application to business as well. If a business man wishes to hire an illegal for whatever reason, it is his property, much like how it is the property of the immigrant in the first example and the property of the family in the second example. By stating that it is illegal to hire an illegal, the state is once again telling the person what they can or can not do with their own property.
I hope I tied this together nicely, this logic worked on the person I was discussing the issue with.
If you don’t support state-administered benefits, then there really isn’t a reason to oppose freedom of movement.
Only 50% of those earning (reported) income pay nearly all of the income tax. It’s not as if my parents haven’t paid a horrendous amount in taxes, but I’ve received more cash from the federal government than I’ve paid it. You rightly point out that the problem is due to the welfare state, but it irks me when people talk as if only illegal immigrants are free riding. Particularly since they are still subject to things like sales taxes and must deal with the government’s devaluation of the dollar like every other American.
Some Americans have killed Americans. What crime is an illegal immigrant qua illegal immigrant committing that should offend a libertarian?
Good examples Michael. I just might use those on a friend of mine who is strongly against illegal immigration.
I really don’t understand how any self-respecting libertarian could be against freedom of movement.
Walter Block: https://mises.org/journals/jls/13_2/13_2_4.pdf
Mises was also pro-immigration: http://mises.org/journals/jls/5_3/5_3_1.pdf
the problem is not with immigration. You don’t abolish or “illegalize” immigration because of the welfare state, or the war on drugs, you abolish the welfare state and the war on drugs because they should be anyway. People should be allowed to live and work where they are welcome with respect to peoples property rights.
Illegal immigration isn’t the problem, but it adds to the problem. Illegal immigrants aren’t flooding into the United States with bounties of money. That means they’re in the bottom bracket for income tax, and either paying little or no taxes for it. Yet they still get the same benefits (probably more) than the highest taxpayer as always. To the government, it looks like more people need government welfare, and then it gets more expensive. It’s a never-ending circle. When we’re picking as to who comes into the United States, we can let in entrepreneurs and innovators who have shown an ability to open their own businesses and offer jobs. People who have proven to work for themselves will be less likely to make everything else more expensive for others, and the welfare state will phase itself out due to the free market.
…Do I want to know what a rape tree is?
Probably not, but I’ll tell you. Basically, when coyotes (who are sometimes illegal immigrants themselves) bring illegal immigrants into the country, they take the girls and rape them. And then steal their underwear and hang it on a tree.
