Intellectual Property and Normative Social Theory

Your dream example is a strawman. Not all information is worth fighting over, the same way not all atoms (air, dirt, etc.), objects (rock, turd, etc.) or cubic feet of tangible universe are worth fighting over. There are plenty of bizarre situations I could create to make tangible property (or resolution of claims over it) look ridiculous, too.

My feeling is that ‘tangible only’ property is remnant of the ‘tangible mostly’ part of human evolution. As people increasingly allocate scarce labor and time toward creation and exchange of non-tangible information objects, the concept of information as property would increasingly make sense to more and more people. Aren’t there already multi-agent internet universes in which real people have real claims over intangible objects?

Are you saying that the creator/owner of the movie “Avatar” and the pirate copiers/sellers of his movie have NON-competing plans?

Are you saying that the creator/owner of the movie “Avatar” and the pirate copiers/sellers of his movie have NON-competing plans?

they may ‘compete’ over ‘expected revenue’, but not the ideal ‘avatar’.

but this competition, is not the same as conflict anyway.

when two artists wish to sell to a single art buyer, they compete for ‘expected revenue’, but the scarce-rival good of the money that they might earn, is owned first buy the buyer, and then by whoever he pays to purchase the art object.

The rival, conflictable, objects in this story, are ‘objects of art’ and ‘gold coins’. both scarce-and rival. ‘expected reveneue’ is not this, and its not technically ‘conflictable’ or ‘rival’, its just… an intangible, and expectation…

Are their plans competing, or not?

[EDIT: Got to go make some tangible $$. Will be back later. Wait, how tangible are the $$ I’ll be making? Hmm…]

‘compete’ is a word rich with semantics so I warn both of us to tread carefully.

they are in competition, but not in conflict. their plans are competing, but not incompatable.and they can both utilise their means without conflict. (without conflict over their means)

This is a fundamental trait of the market economy. Competing agents, with competing plans, which would be incompatible if those plans involved any two agents ‘fully controlling’ the same rivalrous property in technically incompatible production processes, because of ownership being precisely allocated, because of the agents plans taking this feature into account, allows for the competing plans that conform to the insititution of private property to be compatible. i.e. conflict is made avoidable over conflictable objects.

if we consider ‘non-conflictable objects’, we hardly need mechanisms to enable conflict avoidance.

I unfortunately have not had the opportunity to read the entire post (let alone the thread), so my apologies if this has already been covered. The issue at hand in this scenario is not means with which person B caused the death of person C. The issue is simply that person B caused the death. Person B created rivalrous conflict over the scarce property that is Person C’s body and life. It is that scarce good that has been taken. Means of doing so is irrelevant.

The statement “there ought be no laws preventing me from utilizing non-scarce ideas” is not synonymous with the statement “there ought be no laws preventing me from utilizing your scarce resources, as long as I do it using non-scarce resources.”

The following idea(s) may be important in this discussion:

Regarding the notions of rivalry and conflict, consider what Mises writes about praxeology and social science generally:

“It is of primary importance to realize that parts of the external world become means only through the operation of the human mind and its offshoot, human action. External objects are as such only phenomena of the physical universe and the subject matter of the natural sciences. It is human meaning and action which transform them into means. Praxeology does not deal with the external world. but with man’s conduct with regard to it. Praxeological reality is not the physical universe, but man’s conscious reaction to the given state of this universe. Economics is not about things and tangible material objects; it is about men, their meanings and actions. Goods, commodities, and wealth and all the other notions of conduct are not elements of nature; they are elements of human meaning and conduct. He who wants to deal with them must not look at the external world; he must search for them in the meaning of acting men.” (HA)(emphasis added)

The reason the underlined is important, is that Mises makes a distinction between the objects of the “external world” or the subject matter of the natural sciences on the one hand, and “notions of conduct” or “elements of human meaning” on the other hand.

This is a distinction similar to the one that is advanced in the current debate, where we are contrasting ideal objects, ideas, mental ideas, on the one hand, with tangible objects on the other hand.

The general principle or idea is that just as “value” is not “in” things (is not a tangible object), but is a function of the attitude of the actor toward the thing in question, so too are all the other notions of conduct not “in” things (so too are they not tangible objects). As Mises writes, what is a good, or what is a commodity, or what is wealth, are not elements of nature, they are elements of human meaning.

If we accept this distinction between the realm of ideas and the realm of tangible objects, then the question will eventually arise as to whether the terms “rivalry” and “conflict” refer to tangible objects of the external world, or, to the world of ideal objects, ideas, mental ideas, etc…

It seems clear that a “rivalry” or a “conflict” is not a tangible object, but rather is a notion of human meaning that belongs to the category of mental ideas.

Just as we might argue that value is not a tangible object but is an idea (attitude, opinion, etc.), so we might argue that a rivalry or a conflict is not a tangible object, but is an idea (attitude, opinion, etc.). The same principle will apply to all other notions of conduct, as Mises suggests.

If this reasoning holds, then by the terms of the anti-IP argument based on the notions of rivalry and conflict, we will assign both of these notions to the category of mental ideas.

In other words, my idea of conflict does not prevent you from having the idea of conflict. My idea of rivalry does not prevent you from having the idea of rivalry, and so on…

This might indicate the following theoretical circumstance:

On the one hand, we might uphold or subscribe to the postulate that no two tangible objects can occupy the same space at the same time. This seems to be a grounding postulate or grounding axiom of natural science, which is primarily concerned with the position of the objects of the “external” world.

On the other hand, the notions of “conflict” and “rivalry,” are not conceived as tangible objects. Instead, we assign these notions to the category of ideas, ideal objects, mental ideas, attitudes, opinions, etc…

Then, what applies to mental ideas generally, applies to the notions of rivalry and conflict too. My having the idea of rivalry does not prevent you from having the idea of rivalry, my having the idea of conflict does not prevent you from having the idea of conflict, etc…

The question then becomes:

How does the assumed fact that my having the idea of conflict or rivalry does not prevent you from having the idea of conflict or rivalry, say something about the spatial position of tangible objects ?

On the one hand we say, A: my having the idea of rivalry or conflict does not prevent you from having the idea of rivalry or conflict.

On the other hand we say, B: therefore, this indicates X spatial position of tangible object O.

How does the assumption of A translate to a conclusion about B?

The following is Bob Schaefer’s critique of the objective conception of scarcity which appeared in his paper “Response to Kinsella: A Praxeological Look at Intellectual Property Rights.”

Introduction

A common, ordinary apple becomes N. Stephan Kinsella’s property by his simple act of plucking it from a tree.1 Yet, a novel authored by John Doe – a novel that originated in Doe’s head and materialized in Doe’s computer – is not owned by John Doe. What kind of reasoning leads one to such a counter-intuitive opinion?

Kinsella writes:

“[B]ecause, ideas are not scarce resources in the sense that physical conflict over their use is possible, they are not the proper subject of property rights designed to avoid such conflicts.”2

When confronted with an argument like Kinsella’s Against Intellectual Property, we are tempted to criticize every word. However, in this case it is necessary to focus on one word in particular because the crux of Kinsella’s argument is his peculiar concept of “scarcity.”

In the first part of this paper we will demolish Kinsella’s concept of scarcity, which underpins his argument against IP rights. We will argue that the wellspring of property rights – all property rights – is not scarcity but human action, more specifically, cooperative human action. In the second part of this paper we will ascertain exactly how human cooperative action implies the concept of property rights. We will present a more practical and sensible understanding of intellectual property and explain why it would properly fit into a libertarian society.

Lastly, our purpose here is specific and narrow. Our primary interest is in copyright. We are not a patent attorney nor a philosopher. Consequently, we will not examine IP law, IP as contract, specific forms of IP (other than copyright) or various libertarian philosophical defenses of IP in general. Our purpose is to demonstrate that Kinsella’s objective justification of property is in error and that copyright as it exists today in our society is wholly legitimate and proper when considered from the point of view of cooperative human action. Ours is primarily a praxeological viewpoint.

Part I

Scarcity is the keystone of Kinsella’s argument for property rights and against IP rights. He writes:

“Thus, scarcity is not the ‘basis’ for property rights, but a necessary background condition that must obtain before property rights can arise or make sense…”3

“Moreover,” he continues, “property rights can apply only to scarce resources. The problem with IP rights is that the ideal objects protected by IP rights are not scarce…”4

Without Kinsella’s omnipotent concept of scarcity his argument has no legs, i.e., property rights of any kind could not, in his own words, either “arise or make sense.” His argument for property rights in general and against IP rights in particular would, consequently, disintegrate. So we must untangle Kinsella’s concept of scarcity with a fine-tooth comb.

In his short tract the word “scarce” appears 59 times and the word “scarcity” 43 times. But just what does Kinsella mean by “scarcity,” this almighty “background condition” that determines whether or not property rights can exist? He never specifically defines the concept. We are forced to impute meaning to the word based on vague phrases and parenthetical remarks.

For instance, Kinsella writes: “A little reflection will show that it is these goods’ scarcity – the fact that there can be conflict over these goods by multiple human actors. The very possibility of conflict over a resource renders it scarce, giving rise to the need for ethical rules to govern its use.”5

But what does Kinsella mean by “conflict,” (“physical conflict”6 or “interpersonal conflict”7)? Based on its grammatical context (“conflict over these goods by multiple human actors” [emphasis added] and “conflicts are avoided and peace and cooperation are achieved”8 [emphasis added]), we might conclude Kinsella intends conflict to mean human strife, i.e., “the very possibility of…[human strife]…over a resource renders it scarce…” However, Kinsella throws this sense of scarcity an immediate curve ball:

“Nature, then,” he writes, “contains things that are economically scarce.”9

Are we now to understand Kinsella to mean that there are things in nature that cause human strife? Or maybe he means there are things in nature that occasion human strife?

We may dismiss the former interpretation as deterministic and behavioristic nonsense. But we must also dismiss the latter interpretation as meaningless and insignificant because it is so broadly true. The latter interpretation is more a comment on human nature than on the scarcity of tangible objects.

Kinsella continues:

“My use of such a thing conflicts with (excludes) your use of it, and vice versa. The function of property rights is to prevent interpersonal conflict over scarce resources, by allocating exclusive ownership of resources to specified individuals (owners).”10

Here Kinsella obviously intends “conflict” to mean something other than human strife. Clearly, he has in mind mutually exclusive utility. True, it is fairly common in nature that Person A’s use of a particular thing “excludes” Person B’s use of that same thing. For example, A’s consuming a bite of apple excludes B’s consumption of that same bite. Does Kinsella believe that property rights can “function” to “prevent” this physical fact of nature, i.e., can enable two human beings to consume the same bite of apple? Such a feat is impossible and tantamount to having your cake and eating it too.

Or does Kinsella want us to understand that the function of property rights is to prevent human strife associated with particular cases of mutually exclusive utility? We think so.

Logicians recognize Kinsella’s argumentative technique as the fallacy of equivocation.11 Kinsella’s argument goes something like this:

Major premise: Scarcity entails possible conflict.
Minor premise: When scarce things are used, conflict is certain and unavoidable.
Conclusion: Therefore, ethical rules of property are needed to prevent conflict over the use of scarce things.

If “conflict” is consistently defined as “human strife” in this syllogism, the major premise is true, but the minor premise is obviously false. Thus, the conclusion does not follow.

On the other hand, if “conflict” is consistently defined as “mutually exclusive utility,” the major and minor premises are contradictory. Thus, the conclusion cannot possibly follow.

Only by equivocating, i.e., by using two distinct and different definitions of the word “conflict,” does the argument’s conclusion seem to follow:12

  1. Scarcity entails possible conflict [human strife].
  2. When scarce things are used, conflict [mutually exclusive utility] is certain and unavoidable.
  3. Therefore, ethical rules of property are needed to prevent conflict [human strife] over the use of scarce things.

Logic does not allow equivocation. So Kinsella’s argument for property and against IP (only “tangible, scarce resources are the possible object [sic] of interpersonal conflict, so it is only for them that property rules are applicable”) is illogical and nonsensical. Kinsella has not only failed to justify property rights, but has also failed to prove that IP rights are unjust.

However, before resting our case against Kinsella’s argument, we must comment further on his peculiar concept of scarcity. It is safe to assume that most economists do not share Kinsella’s concept of scarcity.13

George Reisman writes:

“Economists almost universally describe the condition in which the desire for wealth exceeds the amount of wealth available as one of ‘scarcity.’ Scarcity, they hold, means any limitation of wealth relative to the need or desire for wealth, irrespective of whether the limitation proceeds from the lack of wealth or the abundance of desires.”14

Murray N. Rothbard writes:

“In the first place, all means are scarce, i.e., limited with respect to the ends that they could possibly serve.”15

Ludwig von Mises writes:

“Means are necessarily always limited, i.e., scarce with regard to the services for which man wants to use them.”16

To our knowledge, not one of these economists links the concept of “scarcity” to the concept of “interpersonal conflict,” whether understood as human strife or mutually exclusive utility. Each views scarcity not in terms of some objective, nature-given condition, but in terms of subjective human action.

Kinsella, on the other hand, is intent on objectifying scarcity, i.e., linking the concept (and its supposed omnipotent qualities) to the objective and given qualities of nature. He writes:

“Nature, then, contains things that are economically scarce.”17 He adds: “Ideas are not naturally scarce.”18

He references Boudewijn Bouckaert as an authority on the notion of “natural scarcity”:

“Bouckaert also argues that natural scarcity is what gives rise to the need for property rules, and that IP laws create an artificial, unjustifiable scarcity.”19

And to reinforce this concept of “natural scarcity,” Kinsella introduces Hans-Hermann Hoppe’s notion of superabundance: “Were we in a Garden of Eden,” Kinsella writes, “where land and other goods were infinitely abundant, there would be no scarcity and, therefore, no need for property rules; property concepts would be meaningless. The idea of conflict, and the idea of rights, would not even arise. For example, your taking my lawnmower would not really deprive me of it if I could conjure up another in the blink of an eye.”20

From all of this we cannot but conclude that Kinsella believes that conflict, property rules and the very concept of property are functions of this concept of natural scarcity, i.e., the available but finite quantities of inanimate objects found in nature. Yet, the science of praxeology proves that nothing could be further from the truth. As the Austrian economists quoted above reveal, the concept of scarcity must always be considered within the context of human action. As Mises writes above, means in nature are “scarce with regard to the services for which man wants to use them.” [Emphasis added]

Let’s be honest. We all know that man does not assess the conditions he imagines to exist in the Garden of Eden before he acts in the real world. Man acts based on his imperfect knowledge of the real world. To the best of our knowledge, we know the following to be true:

  1. That the earthly supply of resources man is able to employ as means to a given end exist in limited and finite quantities; and
  2. That one man’s consumption of one unit of this supply of resources necessarily prevents another man’s consumption of that self-same unit.

However, it is clear that the above objective conditions imposed by nature, whether considered individually or together, do not imply human strife, economic scarcity (natural or artificial) or property (tangible or intellectual). These particular concepts only become imaginable when a third condition imposed by nature is considered: acting man.

Kinsella’s scarcity argument attempts to draw a direct, logical line from the objective and given conditions of nature to the subjective, human notion of property. Such a line cannot be drawn any more than it can be drawn from the natural means available on earth to the particular ends sought by an individual human actor. This understanding is fundamental to Austrian economics.

Interpersonal conflict – human strife – is not determined by the absolute quantity of goods or resources in existence. It should be obvious that conflict is absent in the Garden of Eden not because there is an infinite quantity (no scarcity) of goods and resources in the Garden, but because, so long as all human wants and desires for goods are satisfied, there can be no human action with regard to goods. Moreover, if conditions change and action is required to achieve satisfaction (e.g., conjuring up another lawnmower), individual action will suffice (e.g., the blinking of an eye). At least with respect to obtaining goods and resources, cooperative action offers no advantage over individual action in Kinsella’s Garden of Eden.

However, in the real world, where goods and resources are limited in quantity, individual action will not suffice. In the real world it is individual human action that determines whether human strife will exist over scarce resources, and it is cooperative human action that eliminates this human strife.

Or is Kinsella telling us that in the real world interpersonal conflict is determined not by human actors but by the autonomic response of the human central nervous system to non-abundant stimuli? Or perhaps he means to imply that nature has hard-wired humans in such a fashion that when faced with a case of mutually exclusive utility we humans naturally engage in interpersonal human strife rather than choose interpersonal cooperation?

Kinsella writes:

“The very possibility of conflict over a resource renders it scarce, giving rise to the need for ethical rules to govern its use.”

He has it exactly backwards. The ethical rules of private property do not mysteriously “rise” out of natural scarcity to prevent human strife. Seeking to eliminate conflict over scarce resources, human actors cooperate. They conceive and implement ethical rules of behavior, rules that make cooperative action possible. The concept of private property is implied by these ethical rules. Thus, as we shall prove in Part II of this paper, property rights – tangible and intangible – are the consequence of human cooperative action, not the consequence of some vague concept of inevitable conflict embedded in naturally scarce, inanimate objects.

As usual, Ludwig von Mises sums it up best. He demolishes Kinsella’s concept of scarcity in a single paragraph:

“The natural scarcity of the means of sustenance forces every living being to look upon all other living beings as deadly foes in the struggle for survival, and generates pitiless biological competition. But with man these irreconcilable conflicts of interests disappear… Within the system of society there is no conflict of interests … … harmony of interests is substituted for conflict. People are no longer rivals in the struggle for the allocation of portions out of a strictly limited supply. They become cooperators in striving after ends common to all of them.”21

I’m afraid I cannot fathom your post.

B is non-sequitor to A. They have no logical relation. And I don’t see where either IP’ers or anti-IP’ers have attempted to link them? (nor why they would…?)

I’m a ‘Kinsellian’ and yet I agree with Mises100% its man’s insitution of private property in scarce&rival tangible objects that raises man above the animals in zero sum games and allows for the conflict of utilisation of resource to be avoided gracefully, and for positive gains.

I think I covered this in an earlier post on competition and compatibility of plans.

Seeking to eliminate conflict over scarce resources, human actors cooperate

property rights – tangible and intangible – are the consequence of human cooperative action, not the consequence of some vague concept of inevitable conflict embedded in naturally scarce, inanimate objects.

this is an interesting dissonance. According to Schaefer’s : men cooperate so as to avoid conflict over scarce resources, but this is not because of the fact that if they did not so cooperate then they would be in conflict over scarce resources …

Adam, I am very disappointed that you avoided addressing my responses.

The questions to you are very simple.

Are ideas property, and what is your definition of property?

A succcinct answer would be appreciated.

In other words, something like this:

Assumed “is” fact 1: Two tangible objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time.

Assumed “is” fact 2: My having an idea does not prevent your having the same idea.

Now we say or maintain something to this effect:

The position of tangible object X is “unjustified.” Or, bodily movement X is “unjustified.” etc…

How are these propositions derived from the assumed is facts 1 and 2 ?

From 1 and 2 it would appear all we can say with regard to tangible objects is that they cannot occupy the same space at the same time.

From 1 and 2 it would appear all we can say about the idea of “unjustified” is that my having the idea of unjustified does not prevent your having the idea of unjustified.

(on the basis of the assumption that unjustified is an idea and not a tangible object)

But how do we derive from assumed is facts 1 and 2 the notion that the position of X or that bodily movement X is “unjustified,” or “rivalrous,” or “conflictual.”

If something is a tangible object, we say it cannot occupy the same space at the same time.

If something is an idea, we say that your possessing it does not prevent my possessing it.

Your possessing the idea of unjustified or rivalrous or conflict, does not prevent my possessing the idea of unjustified or rivalrous or conflict.

How do we get more out of assumed is facts 1 and 2 than this ?

if you are interested in the concept of justification you should note that justification occurs in argument and go from there.

Hoppean.

Adam, until you define property, going back to arguing against normative justifications is avoiding the issue.

Right. The anti-IP arguments most of us make are simply pointing out, inter alia, that IP law is incompatible with libertarian property rights. It appeals to a fellow libertarians’ already-held libertarian views.

There are other arguments one can add, if addressing a non-libertarian–the first one being: be a libertarian!

Liberty student: yes, the first question is: are ideas a type of ownable thing at all. No; ideas are just information, ideas, patterns, recipes. Information and knowledge help guide action–help the actor select his ends, and the means to try to achieve the end chosen. But the action itself employs scarce means. Property pertains to the means employed by an actor to achieve ends, not the information in his head that guides his very choices.

Liberty Student:

I do not subscribe to the libertarian private property theory and I think it would be counter-productive for me to try to argue while staying within the conceptual confines of this system as it has been propounded by Rothbard, Hoppe, Kinsella, and others.

At the risk of repeating myself, to me this would be like answering a question such as:

Is X Feng Shui or not ?

Is X blessed or not ?

Do you believe X is justified or not ?

These questions refer to well-defined systems of philosophical (in the broad sense) thought. They are conceptual systems belonging to defined world-views, or even, conceptual systems constituting defined world-views.

My view of social theory is generally in accord with a Misesian position, as you already know.

In this system there are generally two acknowledged realms:

  1. Value-free theory that stays within the realm of “is” statements or descriptive analysis.

  2. The realm of personal value judgments or the realm of the wants of the individual.

Realm #1 is generally rendered theoretically in the form, if X, then Y.

Realm #2 is generally rendered in the form: I want X

In this scheme, the question “what is X” is viewed more as a metaphysical question, or at least a question indicating an interest in “ontological realism,” i.e., the inquiry as to what things “really are.”

By contrast, in the Misesian system, the question would always be rendered: “What is X to actor A” (theoretical subjectivism, the hallmark of Austrian analysis)

The argument that ideas really are, or really are not, property, seems to belong to an ontological-theoretical pursuit. And ontological conceptions seem to be those favored by metaphysical or ontological realists (objective realism), and ethical objectivists.

I might say that with respect to what property “is” or how property is defined, I am neutral.

With respect to the possible inconsistencies of a given social theory such as the libertarian private property theory(s), I try to point those out.

I’d like to see your critics address this ^^^ before challenging any normative claims you make as a libertarian. Refusing to define terms is a lousy way to argue.

Adam, you again avoided aswering my very simple questions. This has nothing to do with feng shui, justifications or repeating yourself.

Do you believe ideas are property, yes or no?

What definition of property are you applying to come to that determination?

These ^^^ are very reasonable questions to ask in a discussion about intellectual property.

This is pretty slippery. “I might say”, “I am neutral”. What does that even mean?

I agree with many of your criticisms of normative justifications, but I think you picked the wrong fight with IP, and I am more sure of that as we continue to discuss, because you won’t even make clear your own position, or that you will ever take a position. That’s a mistake in my opinion, because there is nothing wrong I can see with the positive foundation of Kinsella and Tucker’s position on IP, and if there is, I would ask you to articulate it clearly and concisely.

Didn’t he just say that he doesn’t think that the question is relevant? Didn’t he just say that even asking that question is missing the point of his critique? Shouldn’t you try to grapple with that argument, instead of just repeating your question?