Monarchy is superior to mass-democracy...if you want a civil war?

I’m a great fan of Hoppe argument against democracy and for monarchy as a comparatively milder form of exploitation. I agree that his argument conforms to both common sense and historical experience.

Yet I know of no attempts made by Hoppe to refute or even address the only argument that Mises ever made for democracy: in the long run its the people’s wishes that get a government into ‘office’. All that democracy does is to ensure that an unpopular government is ousted peacefully, sparring the country the horrors of civil strife. A monarch, on the other hand, would have to be deposed by force of arms. And knowing the history of Europe after the French Revolution the monarchist-republican struggle can last generations.

Do you know of any comments I’m missing that Hoppe might have written somewhere on the issue, and if not, what’s you take on the issue: is still monarchy preferable to democracy?

Unpopular government is not ousted in democracy. The door just revolves a bit.

I agree, but that’s not what most voters think, and that is what matters. To them it’s real. In particularly dire straits all that is needed is a flamboyant leader, and people think that things are really changing.

“the only argument that Mises ever made for democracy”

Where?

Where?

Writes Mises in “Liberalism” (annotation mine):

Government by a handful of people […] depends on the consent of the governed, i.e., on their acceptance of the existing administration. They may see it only as the lesser evil, or as an unavoidable evil, yet they must be of the opinion that a change in the existing, situation would have no purpose. But once the majority of the governed becomes convinced [to overthrow the old regime] the days of the former are numbered. The majority will have the power to carry out its wishes by force even against the will of the old regime. In the long run no government can maintain itself in power if it does not have public opinion behind it […]

There is, therefore, in every form of polity a means for making the government at least ultimately dependent on the will of the governed, viz, civil war, revolution, insurrection.

But it is just this expedient that liberalism wants to avoid. There can be no lasting economic improvement if the peaceful course of affairs is continually interrupted by internal struggles. […] A fratricidal struggle like the French Revolution of 1789 cost a heavy loss in life and property. Our present economy could no longer endure such convulsions. The population of a modern metropolis would have to suffer so frightfully from a revolutionary uprising that could bar the importation of food and coal and cut off the flow of electricity, gas, and water that even the fear that such disturbances might break out would paralyze the life of the city. Here is where the social function performed by democracy finds its point of application.

**Democracy is that form of political constitution which makes possible the adaptation of the government to the wishes of the governed without violent struggles.**If in a democratic state the government is no longer being conducted as the majority of the population would have it, no civil war is necessary to put into office those who are willing to work to suit the majority. By means of elections and parliamentary arrangements, the change of government is executed smoothly and without friction, violence, or bloodshed. (p.41-42)

And latter on, speaking of the idealistic high hopes many have of democracy:

Since mankind entered the age of democracy with such high-flown expectations, it is not surprising that disillusionment should soon have set in. It was quickly discovered that the democracies committed at least as many errors as the monarchies and aristocracies had. The comparison that people drew between the men whom the democracies placed at the head of the government and those whom the emperors and kings, in the exercise of their absolute power, had elevated to that position, proved by no means favorable to the new wielders of power.

The French are wont to speak of “killing with ridicule.” And indeed, the statesmen representative of democracy soon rendered it everywhere ridiculous. Those of the old regime had displayed a certain aristocratic dignity, at least in their outward demeanor. The new ones, who replaced them, made themselves contemptible by their behavior. Nothing has done more harm to democracy in Germany and Austria than the hollow arrogance and impudent vanity with which the Social-Democratic leaders who rose to power after the collapse of the empire conducted themselves.

Thus, wherever democracy triumphed, an antidemocratic doctrine soon arose in fundamental opposition to it. There is no sense, it was said, in allowing the majority to rule. The best ought to govern, even if they are in the minority. This seems so obvious that the supporters of antidemocratic movements of all kinds have steadily increased in number. The more contemptible the men whom democracy has placed at the top have proved themselves to be, the greater has grown the number of the enemies of democracy. (p.43)

Did you not see this?

Good point. I too think that the Misesian free secession idea allows for a bloodless change of any kind of government. But still the original Misesian argument of the function of democracy does apply to modern mass democracy, which allows for no secession. Thus, in the confines of the argument ‘monarchy vs. democracy’, it still favors democracy and not monarchy.

So, sure a monarchy that publicly recognized the right of any, say, 10,000 people to secede would avoid civil strife, but say that unlimited secession is not feasible, and neither is outright anarchy. Would we still prefer democracy to monarchy for governing, say, post WWI Germany, a time when the public opinion was certainly not ready to accept full seccession or anarchy?

Can I be the monarch?

Can I be the monarch?

Depends. Do you have balls of steel?

There is no illusion that “we the people” are the government.

The fact that there are rulers is crystal clear. Rulers vs. ruled. Even if the populace is under the delusion of divine right of kings, and even if there is a violent revolution… it PALES in comparision to the MASS WARS of World War 1, 2, Vietnam etc etc etc… that take place under democracy.

It’s a drop in the bucket when comparing the revolutionary rise of the people versus the rulers (which is all liklihood - just), as opposed to unjustified and deadly wars of the mass people versus other mass people.

Furthermore, a revolution - one that was libertarian, has the non aggression principle at it’s core. Where is this violent revolution coming from aye?

Alas, I have dim hopes of a libertarian revolution in the political sense. What I was thinking of was, say, a revolution in Saudi Arabia seeking a more comprehensive ‘social security net’ (what would have happened too the Second Reich if Bismarck had not preemptively satiated these requests). Or a more ‘religiously pure’ regime, for that matter (as happened with Iran).

At least with a democracy people would get a ‘social’ or theocratic government in place and that’d be it. Turkey is being able to shift to a more assertive and theocratic government due to democracy. Had the Sultanate been retained (had Mustafa Kemal been shot in the head in Gallipoli), would a repetition of the Iranian uprising be that impossible? At what cost for the economy?

But you make a very good point, that democracies take in total, pointless wars what they give in internal struggles.

What about the 30 Year’s War, The Time of Troubles, the Taiping Rebellion?

Depends. Do you have balls of steel?

Ha, not my genitals, no. But you can teach yourself to suck them up so that they cant get hurt.