There must be a lot of students in here, so I was wondering if anyone in this forum is actually under the illusion that their BA is worth anything…
Who exactly chose the arbitrary figure of Four years? Does it really take four years to master Women’s Studies or Sociology? Especially when you consider that even Law School is only 3 years, and Medical School, 4.
Why can’t we have equivalency certificates that can signify an individual’s competence in any given field?
AFAIK, the 4 year BA still holds a lot of weight with employers.
Why aren’t equivalency certificates accepted more often by employers?
There are some similar ideas like CLEP tests, but they are mostly for individual classes not entire fields and they still depend on the disgusting higher education system for acceptance.
I’ve been reading a number of articles that Gary North wrote on the college scam. The only thing is that I feel horrible for not having found this information before enrolling and even worse for not being smart enough for engineering, which is one of the few really worthwhile programs to go to college for.
Depends on what degree you did and whether or not it was something you truly appreciated or use in a career or calling.
A university degree can be life enriching and valuable to one’s self development. While he/she may not be able to find a job directly relating to the subject, it can be used as a stepping stone to a different field or a higher level of education.
Conversely, a vocation or a trade may give you the skills to perform a job to earn a higher wage. But he/she may not be enlightened by their studies, or encouraged to learn more than is necessary to perform the specific job.
I have a university degree, but it’s not in economics or business or in the arts.
Law school should be two years at most. Probably the same for college. College-track high schoolers should be out by age 16. Everybody else should be in a trade school by age 14.
Come on, you really believe that? All it testifies to is your unpaid student loans or your tremendous family wealth. Or that scholarship for a few. Can you truly say that its actually worth 20 grand/yr to sit and listen to leftist professors for 4 years?
Looking at the kids around me in college, I was reminded more of high school than anything else. Which is why after wasting 2 years in college, I have decided to leave it to pursue something else. At least I will have a marketable skill in a while, instead of a BA in Women’s Studies or Sociology or Noam Chomsky studies.The BA is useless now, its like a high school diploma. Completely diluted and over inflated.
Ideally, I wish an industry would take off which would offer these equivalency diplomas that would be equally respected (unlike the GED) and wouldn’t take more than a few tests or few weeks to complete.This would help out kids who can’t afford to party for 4 years and also keep out the feeble minded who seem to slip through the cracks and come out with a BA. It would also sideline the left wing sanctuary that is academia.
diluted and over inflated –yes. though, every job application I have ever filled out has a checkbox for “highest level of education completed” and then has choices such as “high school diploma”, “bachelors”, “graduate”, etc. I am not arguing that this is an inefficient process for screening, just pointing out that it exists. so, unless you plan to work for yourself, a BA, currently, is not useless.
I have a sense that this apparent handicap can be overcome with perseverence - “Sell yourself.”. While a BS is required on paper, I think when it comes down to it, experience in the field is much more desireable - experience difficult to obtain with the current child labor laws, compulsory school hours, and minwages.
I think that in the philosophies or when you put forward arguments, it helps to have a degree for rounding out socrates’ ethos, pathos, logos triangle of persuasion.
www.bain4weeks.com has interesting howto for getting your degree on your own. Still not easy, but if you put the time in, you can get it done in probably a year or two.
Depends on what you want to do. If you’re going to be in engineering, math, medicine, or any of the hard sciences except biology, then stick to college. It might be a good choice.
If you aren’t averse to learning a trade, then go to a trade school. Learn a real skill. At least you wont be unemployed like the African American Studies major when SHTF.
Or if you have a business plan, you can start your own business and be your own employer.
Go to college if you can! Since you’re here you’re probably bright enough to get good grades. That’s (almost) as good for social status as good looks are! Go there, but be critical, of course. It’s useful to know what others think that they know.
I do, but I am starting to slowly realize that college, a place that has been hyped as the sole chance for survival since I first walked into Kindergarten, is really a massive waste of time, money, and energy.
I am watching my student loan payments starting to pile up, and I have learned more reading primary sources than I could have ever learned in a mediocre state college. I am a little bit afraid of what I would do if I dropped out. I do know that I loathe this place, and I am desperate to get out. I have an interest in journalism, and in teaching. Is it possible to do these things without a degree? Is it worth it to suck it up to pursue a degree in political science, economics, or history?
No, you need the paper (degree) that states you are qualified to be a Teacher or Journalist. Stick with it.
If you’re going to go to university to learn German or English or Philosophy or Art History then unless you go on to get a Phd and work for an institute or museum then yes these degrees may not secure you the job you expect. But guys, if you want to be an Engineer, Statistician, Pharmacist, Doctor, Nurse, Lawyer, Economist, Accountant, … you need the education. You may argue that you can book learn it on your own. True you can learn some of it on your own. But a university program sets the standard to ensure you learn it to the extent required to be qualified for the job. In the case of Engineer, Pharmacist, Doctor, Lawyer, etc.. these jobs require not only university education but a license - which typically involves examinations following 4 years on the job training under the supervision of other similarly licensed professionals. 100 years ago many times you worked as an apprentice under someone, while studying. Then with examinations you earned the degree. Things are more regulated by universities now. I’m sure some of you may argue the validity and “price control” of the profession by such requirements, but they are for a reason. I don’t want to drive over a bridge that was designed by someone that failed structural design 101 two times in a row. I don’t want surgery from a doctor that failed out his first time around and only had a 50% average. Not only is skill a factor in obtaining such licenses, but ethics and diligence are also requirements to qualify to maintain qualification for the license.
Two of the most influentual people in my life have no high school diploma. My mother does not have one, she dropped out to get married to my dad. My Grandfather does not have a high school diploma. He left at 8th grade to raise his family by himself after his mother died, and his father gone.
Also, my own father is an engineer, and a damn good one at that, with no engineering degree. The company he works for, recently laid off a bunch of engineers at his firm that had BA’s in engineering. He was brought into a room and told personally, that they were not considering laying him off. To show him that they meant it, they gave him a raise and asked that he not tell his coworkers.
Then you’d better pray that bridge wasn’t designed by some AA graduate from a state college.
I’d rather have someone who has been subject to rigorous testing be certified to design a bridge than an individual who went to a 4 year school to take more classes in unrelated subjects than his/her declared major.
Too bad my economics class is really The Glory of Keynes 101. Currently, I am sitting in a history class listening to a professor blast Warren Harding for having a government for the rich. In the words of Gary North, Indoctrination U.
