Why is Hollywood so certain that making a serious, non-ridiculous movie would not be profitable? It seems like lots of high-brow, quasi-accurate movies did very well; such as the insanely long Cleopatra or Gone with the Wind. While not remotely historical (and barely Biblical) the Ten Commandments, Spartacus and A Man for All Seasons were pretty stellar, too. Or is it just that there is no one left in Hollywood capable of making them if they wanted to?
Crap, and all of those movies were made in the 60s, I think.
I don’t think it’s just selection, either. Sure, all of the non-Mozarts got filtered out of our classical music collection but is there anyone who’s a Mozart anymore? Especially in the major music industries? All of the ‘great’ movies people talk about today, such as Avatar or Pan’s Labyrinth seem little more than a showcase for special effects, badly thought-out plots, trite dialogue and ridiculously bad physics. They don’t seem to make movies with actual characters anymore, just set pieces. Titanic could be an exception, and it did very well. While I don’t much care about the Titanic, I have to admit that it was vastly better put together than Star Trek. It also did a Hell of a lot better, so what is Hollywood’s problem?
I know most people are dull and easily entertained, but at the same time so long as the subject is not too obscure or weird (i.e., Dune) even the slack-jawed movie goer seems to appreciate a well constructed plot and acting that doesn’t seem like it’s being read off the page.
The best movie I have seen in a year or two as on HBO, their Sunset Limited adaptation.
I am a sucker for all those films (and even those old Sinbad/ Greek Haryhausen films). I often wonder about that; it may actually be a bit of a cultural brain drain, or it may havesomething to do with CGI, fast cuts, and the fact that budgets and technology can replace stories (something that could not have happened 15 years ago). Just look at Star Wars the old ones are better written and better to look at (though I still give Lucas credit for some good sword fighting scenes in the newer ones, he is better at filming action than most modern day directors).
Also, if you like Greek Tragedy Mihalis Kakogiannis (director of Zorba thtth did three really good films (all on netflix) you may want to check out, particularly Iphegenia
Also, if you like Greek Tragedy Mihalis Kakogiannis did three really good films (all on netflix) you may want to check out, particularly Iphegenia
Jesus, he made a movie out of Eurypides? I have got to check this out. I love 70’s Italian cinema on its own.
P.S. wasn’t Cleopatra a notorious bomb?
The Augustus-worshipping historians hated it and it was insanely expensive; but it does quite well in DVD sales now. But yes, it was not a big theater success.
Let’s avoid retrospective bias. Great movies are selfdom recognized as such in their time. No one will remember Titanic or Avatar. On the other hand, I suspect FightClub, Inception, The Matrix and LuckyNumberSlevin will be remembered for some time.
The Augustus-worshipping historians hated it and it was insanely expensive; but it does quite well in DVD sales now. But yes, it was not a big theater success.
Because outdated political bumper stickers amuse me to no end, I always wanted to make a “Don’t Blame Me I Voted for Lepidus” bumper sticker.
Just occured to me. While they aren’t quite up to snuff with what is being mentioned it is odd how some comic book movies tend to be the only tolerable big budget thing anymore.
That’s because they’re Pagan mythology, which is much better than the milksop Christian mythology we get from Matrix junk.
To elaborate on my vast disappointment with the Matrix movies: poorly done, too short John Woo knock-off gun fights, gibberish Solipsist plotline, bad acting, cheesy dialogue, badly done Jesus pastiche plus uber generic ‘Hero’s Journey’; not to mention the repetitive ‘machinez are gunna kill us’ BS. No thank you. Goldeneye was more profound than the Matrix.
I actually atttended a live Q & A with him, he is a strange fellow. That said it should be against forum rules to recommend that movie to anybody. I think they use it as a form of torture in N Korea
It really depends on who we’re talking about is doing the remembering. I wouldn’t be surprised if the kids who talk about Fight Club and The Matrix 10-15 years from now are the same kind of kids who talk about flicks like Labyrinth and Rocky Horror Picture Show today. Like, for some reason people think it’s cool to like Bowie decades after he was cool. Like, you’re hip because you actually pretend to like drag before it was popularized on Logo.
…But then again, those movie suck. At least the kids of the future won’t have to pretend. And people will remember Titanic. Maybe not Avatar (hell, I had already forgotten about it)…but Titanic will always be around. Like all those films that started this thread.
meh. i think it is too easy to fret over the dearth of quality/originality in hollywood movies (even though i do it myself).
it is possible that we are living through a middle-brow dark ages. But i personally think the jury is still out.
though even if we were we are likely living through a golden age of television. sopranos, battlestar gallactica, the wire, mad men, etc are all recent shows that are very complex, have extensive followings, and would simply not work as self-contained films.
and maybe this is exactly what we should expect. although i love going out to the movies, most people don’t. and why should they really? “drive 20 minutes to pay $8 so i can watch some piece of crap on someone else’s big screen?? fuck that. dexter is new tongiht!!!”
maybe the rise of good television can only come with the fall of hollywood. if so, i am not sure it is an uneven trade.
Your point re TV is well taken but there really aren’t that many truly great TV serials. Battlestar would have been great if it would have been 1 series but at 4 it drags seriously badly; I gave up after the cop out ending of the Pegasus two-parter in series 2. The Wire is great but I wouldn’t label much current serials with that brush.
At this point we must remember very good and excellent TV/film is quite rare. This is easily forgotten with access to the anals of TV/film via DVD. That said there are normaly around one or two films a year which are American (so Hollywoodish) which I’d rate as a 9 or so. In the last few years titles such as There WIll Be Blood, Gran Torino and Toy Story 3 would come into that category.
However there does seem to be a gamut of low brow crap spewing out of every Hollywood orriface. But why? The main blame has to go to the public for putting up with total banality. If they had an iota of discernment these films would never have been made. So for the most part I blame the public schooling system for turning kids into drones and their parents who would prefer to let TV do the job from birth.
In short the best way to see a rise in the quality of films in the long run is to abolish the public schools and welfare to parents, more often than not to parent (singular).
Marko,
I agree that 100mins can be a limiting factor in story telling but having too much time can be a vice. See here.
Breaking Bad, The Wire, The Shield, Oz, Sopranos. And that is just the crime stuff.
At the moment I am watching Chuck (cracks me up) and looking forward to new seasons of Sons of Anarchy (a little campy, but entertaining), Boardwalk Empire (a little boring, but has potential) and Breaking Bad. And anticipating The Game of Thrones series to launch in April.
Personally I don’t feel a drout. I am being well entertained (virtually free of charge).
Now hold on for just a minute, here. Did you really say “the Matrix movies”?? When the Wachowski brothers made The Matrix, it was obvious they had no intention of making a sequel for it. The story was self-contained and the metaphorical message of the movie was clear. They only made the sequels because they were forced to by the business side, I’m guessing. The second and third Matrix movies are unrecognizable… they have a “bolt on” feel. The special effects were great but that’s about it.
Neo - a metaphor for enlightenment to the “desert of the real” and the system of control, the “prison you cannot taste or touch or see… a prison for your mind” - is more powerful than the Matrix itself… and he’s more of a Moses than a Jesus, the movie closes with Neo saying, “I know you’re out there. I can feel you now. I know that you’re afraid. You’re afraid of us. You’re afraid of change. I don’t know the future. I didn’t come here to tell you how this is going to end. I came here to tell you how it’s going to begin. I’m going to hang up this phone, and then I’m going to show these people what you don’t want them to see. I’m going to show them a world … without you. A world without rules and controls, without borders or boundaries; a world where anything is possible. Where we go from there is a choice I leave to you.” [Neo looks into the audience for the final “you”.] His very name choice is meaningful… he represents the upsetting of the status quo… and ushering in of the new.
Any movie that shows a stoner/hacker/pirate and his friends in the BDSM underworld as the good guys can’t be that bad.
Revolutions hadn’t even any special effect worthy of mention as a redeeming feature. It was just a “let’s get it over with” thing. Reloaded, on the other hand, was an eye pleaser.