The porn industry is more morally and ethically degrading than individuals using drugs, and the porn business (up til recently) was bringing in a lot of profit. (I’ve watched some lectures on the porn industry.)
Before I continue with this I’d like to explain why I single out drugs (which includes alcohol and tobacco). Drugs are (a) extremely harmful, (b) designed to be addictive, (c) alters human behavior and directly affects third parties.
Point A is not unique to drugs, indeed many products are harmful for consumers, but adults are mature enough to make their own choices. My position is that B and C makes these products entirely unique, and if we agree that the government needs to provide some sort of defense for people against criminals, defend the rich from the poor (prevent something like the 1848 reign of terror), and support a decentralized legal system, then this industry should be the sole source of revenue. If charities, for whatever reason, are nonexistent, or extremely scarce, and if there’s revenue left over, then it should go towards the most desperate members of society.
I’m not talking about “banning drugs,” and anyone who raises straw men like Mr. muffinberg will be ignored.
So please, don’t turn me into a progressive. This thread is about laissez-faire and my positions. Also, I don’t like people who openly claim that banking should be entirely regulated because “people are ignorant of how FRB operates” talking down to me.
Again, in my perfect world there are no taxes on anything but drugs and on corporations who seek legal privileges. People over the age of 35 and with property can vote. There is no interventionism/inflationism/regulations on anything–the government has no influence on the economy besides taxing the industries mentioned. If this is not consistent with laissez-faire, as it’s defined everywhere in the world but here, then please tell me why. If you simply believe that laissez-faire means anarchy, then this conversation is a waste of time.
Fine, then let’s tax automobiles so that 30,000 people a year in the USA won’t die. No wait, they are already taxed, and 30,000 people a year in the USA die.
“Before I continue with this I’d like to explain why I single out drugs (which includes alcohol and tobacco). Drugs are (a) extremely harmful, (b) designed to be addictive, (c) alters human behavior and directly affects third parties.”
The same could be said of pornography.
So you are completely for making revenue off products that give individuals pleasure (and an act, smoking, which has been around for hundreds of years) to support defense?
This brings me to another question: defense from what? Are we keeping standing armies all over the place in peace time?
Please, read my comments before you hastily respond.
How many people attack and rob people over porn?
There are other dangers, and why is the number incidents relevant? Furthermore, how will making it more difficult to obtain drugs legally reduce the amount of crimes committed to obtain drugs?
This is a secondary affect (this is the fourth time I’m saying this, but the main purpose of the tax is revenue), and the reasoning is simple: taxing something reduces consumption. The physical nature and chemical properties of drugs makes it unique; no one disputes this, and yet, we’re still comparing drugs to cars for some reason.
Okay. So why do you want the government to have more revenue?
You want to forcefully reduce consumption. You don’t want the market to work itself out, nor do you want people to think for themselves whether or not they should take it. Also, the physical and chemical properties of drugs is irrelevant if more people die per year from car crashes than drugs. You are trying to drive your point home that drugs are dangerous, yet they can be no more dangerous than driving on crowded public roads, statistically.
egh, you ignored me. Just keep focusing on the weakest arguments thrown at you. In the mean time…
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Calculation Problem
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Knowledge Problem
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Incentive Problem
etc etc.
Taxation, of course. You’re taking the moral stand that taxing drugs, alcohol, and tobacco is The Right Thing To Do in order to obtain funding for welfare. So let me ask you… what happens if someone refuses to pay the tax? Are you still morally in the right if you imprison them? What happens if they resist arrest? Are you still morally in the right if you shoot them?
Like a mixed economy, men of mixed premises may be called “gray”; but, in both cases, the mixture does not remain “gray” for long. “Gray,” in this context, is merely a prelude to “black.” There may be “gray” men, but there can be no “gray” moral principles. Morality is a code of black and white. When and if men attempt a compromise, it is obvious which side will necessarily lose and which will necessarily profit.
Such are the reasons why—when one is asked: “Surely you don’t think in terms of black-and-white, do you?”—the proper answer (in essence, if not in form) should be: “You’re damn right I do!”
From “The Cult of Moral Grayness” by Ayn Rand.
They can’t refuse, it’s a consumption tax (automatically added on).
Completely failed to address the gun in the room.
There are always ways to avoid paying taxes. In this case, the seller could refuse to pay them (perhaps to offer a lower price to consumers).
You know that currently organized crime sells tax-free cigarettes on the black market right?
Are you 12?
I guess I would charge them penalties, and if they didn’t pay, I would close them down.
for the crime of mutually consenting capitalist acts.
Esuric,
What institutional elements would you put in place which could help ensure that the government does not grow beyond the point you intend it to be? It seems pretty obvious that no government would remain that small for any length of time.
Also, as other people mentioned, there are many ways to get around taxes. If people do not comply, you think that you have the right to shut their business down and possibly economically ruin them and their families?
Oh you wanted all 88 Reasons?
Addiction:
Animals Exposed To Marijuana’s Active Component Will Self-Administer The Drug (NIDA, National Institute on Drug Abuse)
Marijuana Withdrawal As Bad As Withdrawal From Cigarettes (Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine)
Marijuana Withdrawal Reported By Teens Seeking Treatment (University of Vermont)
Smoking, Drinking, Drugs: The Younger They Start, The Harder It Is To Quit (Center For The Advancement Of Health)
Gateway Drug:
Cannabis linked to use of amphetamines (Addiction Journal)
Brain Studies Tie Marijuana to Other Drugs (Science/AAAS)
Early cannabis abuse ‘leads to heroin addiction’ (Mount Sinai School of Medicine)
Early marijuana use increases risk of drug and alcohol problems later in life (Washington University School of Medicine)
Illicit Drug Use Starts With Cannabis (University of Otago, New Zealand)
Marijuana use linked to hallucinogen use (Johns Hopkins University Bloomberg School of Public Health)
National Study Shows “Gateway” Drugs Lead to Cocaine Use (Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse)
Brain Damage:
Cannabis and adolescence: A dangerous cocktail (McGill University Health Centre)
Cannabis ‘can cause psychosis in healthy people’ (Institute of Psychiatry, King’s College London)
Cannabis Could Increase Risks Of Psychotic Illness By 40 Percent (The Lancet Medical Journal)
Cannabis Increases Risk Of Psychosis (British Medical Journal)
Cannabis increases risk of depression and schizophrenia (British Medical Journal)
Cannabis ingredient causes toxic psychosis (University of Lausanne, Switzerland)
Cannabis smokers ‘are taking huge risk of psychotic illness’ (Institute of Psychiatry, King’s College London)
Cannabis Triggers Transient Schizophrenia-like Symptoms (Neuropsychopharmacology Journal)
Cannabis use ‘dulls the brain’ (Journal of the American Medical Association)
Concerns over mental health risk of smoking cannabis (British Journal of Psychiatry)
Daily Consumption Of Cannabis Predisposes To Appearance Of Psychosis And Schizophrenia (University of Granada)
Daily Pot Smoking May Hasten Onset of Psychosis (Emory University)
Early Cannabis Use Increases Risk of Schizophrenia (University of Otago, New Zealand)
Frequent Marijuana Use May Affect Brain Function (NeuroReport Journal)
Heavy Cannabis Use May Lead to Psychotic Symptoms (University of Otago, New Zealand)
Heavy Marijuana use has a detrimental impact on intelligence (Canadian Medical Association Journal)
Heavy Marijuana Use May Damage Developing Brain In Teens, Young Adults (Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia)
How Marijuana Causes Memory Deficits (Nature Neuroscience)
How Smoking Marijuana Damages The Fetal Brain (Science Journal)
Lab study shows THC exposure as adolescents linked to negative effects of THC as adults (Federation of American Societies for Experimental Biology)
Long-term Cannabis Users May Have Structural Brain Abnormalities (Archives of General Psychiatry Journal)
Marijuana And Alcohol Taken Together Induced Widespread Nerve Cell Death In Brains Of Young Rats (Annals of Neurology Journal)
Marijuana Damages Brain (King’s College London)
Marijuana Is Linked to Brain Damage (The Lancet Medical Journal)
Marijuana Use Affects Blood Flow In Brain Even After Abstinence (Neurology Journal)
Marijuana use in pregnancy damages kids’ learning (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences)
Marijuana Use Takes Toll On Adolescent Brain Function (American Academy of Pediatrics)
Memory, speed of thinking get worse over time with marijuana use (American Academy of Neurology)
More Evidence Of Cannabis-induced Psychosis (BMC Psychiatry Journal)
New research reveals how cannabis alters brain function (Institute of Psychiatry, King’s College London)
Scans reveal brain damage from cannabis is like schizophrenia (Albert Einstein College of Medicine)
Schizophrenia Linked To Dysfunction In Molecular Brain Pathway Activated By Marijuana (Archives of General Psychiatry Journal)
Skunk ‘poses greatest risk of psychosis’ (Institute of Psychiatry, King’s College London)
Skunk smokers 18 times more likely to be psychotic (Royal College of Psychiatrists)
Smoking Marijuana Impairs Cognitive Function In MS Patients (Neurology Journal)
Starting marijuana use during teens may result in cognitive impairment later in life (NIH/National Institute on Drug Abuse)
Teen Drug Use Associated With Psychiatric Disorders Later In Life (NIH/National Institute On Drug Abuse)
Teen Marijuana Use Worsens Depression, Leads To More Serious Mental Illness (Office of National Drug Control Policy)
Cancer:
Cannabis alters human DNA (University of Leicester, UK)
Marijuana ingredient promotes tumor growth, impairs anti-tumor defenses (NIH/National Institute on Drug Abuse)
Marijuana Use Linked to Increased Risk of Testicular Cancer (Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center)
Marijuana Use Associated with HPV-Positive Head and Neck Cancer (Journal of the National Cancer Institute)
Smoking Marijuana May Increase Risk Of Head And Neck Cancers (Cancer Epidemiology Biomarker and Prevention Journal)
Tobacco is ‘less risky than dope’ (Memorial Sloan–Kettering Cancer Center)
Gum Disease:
Heavy Marijuana Use Linked To Gum Disease (Journal of the American Medical Association)
Heart Disease:
Adolescent binging on marijuana linked to stroke (Saint Louis University)
Marijuana use can trigger heart attack (Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center)
Marijuana Use May Pose Health Threat To Baby Boomers (American Heart Association Circulation Journal)
Possible Connection Between Marijuana Abuse And Stroke Or Heart Attacks (Molecular Psychiatry Journal)
Regular Cannabis May Increase Risk Of Stroke In Young Users (British Medical Journal)
Infertility:
Abusing Marijuana May Overload System, Inhibit Fertility (American Society for Cell Biology)
Marijuana-Like Compounds May Alter Human Fertility (American Society of Cell Biology)
Sperm From Marijuana Smokers Move Too Fast Too Early, Impairing Fertility (American Society of Reproductive Medicine)
Lung Disease:
Growing Evidence Of Marijuana Smoke’s Potential Dangers (American Chemical Society)
Impact on lungs of 1 cannabis joint equal to up to 5 cigarettes (British Medical Journal)
Long-term Marijuana Smoking Leads To Respiratory Complaints (Archives of Internal Medicine Journal)
Marijuana associated with same respiratory symptoms as tobacco (Yale School of Medicine)
Marijuana Smoke Contains Higher Levels Of Certain Toxins Than Tobacco Smoke (American Chemical Society)
Marijuana Smokers Face Rapid Lung Destruction – As Much As 20 Years Ahead Of Tobacco Smokers (Respirology Journal)
Marijuana Smoking Increases Risk Of COPD For Tobacco Smokers (Canadian Medical Association Journal)
Marijuana Worsens COPD Symptoms In Current Cigarette Smokers (American Thoracic Society)
Research Confirms Adverse Effects of Cannabis on Respiratory Health (University of Otago, New Zealand)
Smoking One Joint is Equivalent to 20 Cigarettes (Medical Research Institute of New Zealand)
Obesity:
Machinery Of The ‘Marijuana Munchies’ (Neuron Journal)
Pregnancy Complication:
Marijuana Use Causes Early Pregnancy Failure (Journal of Clinical Investigation)
Marijuana use could cause tubal pregnancies (Vanderbilt University Medical Center)
Viral Infection:
Marijuana Component Opens The Door For Virus That Causes Kaposi’s Sarcoma (Cancer Research Journal)
Regular Marijuana Use Increases Risk Of Hepatitis C-related Liver Damage (AGA Clinical Gastroenterology and Hepatology Journal)
Vomiting:
Severe Vomiting Sickness With Chronic Cannabis Abuse (World Journal of Gastroenterology)
Myth - Pain Relief:
Active ingredients in marijuana found to spread and prolong pain (University of Texas Medical Branch at Galveston)
Cannabis ‘no better than codeine’ for headaches (The Independent, UK)
Doubts on cannabis for pain relief (Flinders Medical Centre, Australia)
Drug trial casts doubt over cannabis-based painkiller for MS sufferers (Daily Mail, UK)
Endocannabinoids can promote pain (Institute of Pharmaceutical Sciences at ETH Zurich)
Oral Cannabis Ineffective In Treating Acute Pain (American Society of Anesthesiologists)
Side effects rule out cannabis for pain and nausea (New Scientist)
Too Much Marijuana Makes Pain Worse, Not Better (University of California, San Diego)
They would be happy to pay the taxes because they are rational actors who realize that this country allows them to sell/buy a product legally banned in all other countries (with the exception of one). Furthermore, they would love not paying income taxes, capital gains taxes, dividend taxes, ect ect. They would also enjoy the fact that they get a functional legal system, a police force which protects them from criminals, and national defense.
Now there’s a man with a plan…
… a central plan